________________________________________________________________________
SPECTROPOP - Spectacular! Retro! Pop!
________________________________________________________________________
There are 25 messages in this issue.
Topics in this digest:
1. Re: the 9th Beatle / This Diamond Ring
From: steveo
2. Little Isidore and the Golden Inquisitors
From: Paul Bryant
3. Re: Songwriter credits, Ringo Starr
From: Artie Wayne
4. Re: Beatle myth/Monkees' demise
From: Clark Besch
5. Re: Songwriter Credits, General Question
From: Clark Besch
6. cigarette commercial music
From: Robert Beason
7. Jackie DeShannon doowop records?
From: Bill George
8. Lou Johnson on the Bacharach box
From: Martin Jensen
9. Re: Burt Bacharach's poduction debut
From: Phil Milstein
10. Anorak/skipping records
From: Stewart Mason
11. Child is Father to the Man
From: ModGirl
12. Los Bravos - Make It Last
From: Ed Rambeau
13. My Name Is Mud
From: Phil Hall
14. Re: varispeed listening
From: Billy G Spradlin
15. Re: Beatle Myth
From: Trevor Ley
16. Re: Spine Shiverers / Big Finishes
From: Billy G Spradlin
17. Japanese Lyrics to "Sukiyaki"
From: David Coyle
18. Re: Joe Butler and Zally
From: Trevor Ley
19. Patty Michaels
From: Ian Chapman
20. That Alan Gordon
From: Steve Harvey
21. Re: Songs that "quote" others
From: Billy G Spradlin
22. Re: Boone & Sebastian & Dylan
From: C Ponti
23. Royal Teens; Bobby Vee; JFK & the Beatles
From: Country Paul
24. The Mary Hopkin Song Contest
From: Mark Frumento
25. Re: Unchained Melody
From: Art Longmire
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 1
Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 19:59:55 -0800 (PST)
From: steveo
Subject: Re: the 9th Beatle / This Diamond Ring
Austin Roberts wrote:
> Alright Martin, I missed by a mile, but at least Leon was
> involved in the session. All that does is let me know that
> the part of my memory that is working tends to toss the
> facts into the air, and whatever lands upright, that's how I
> remember it. There were 7 Beatles, weren't there???
Austin,
lol. Yes, there were at least 7 Beatles, perhaps 9?
Brian Epstein, George Martin, and Murray the K
were all 5th Beatles. Pete Best was in a way, as
well.
As far as This Diamond Ring goes, it is a good song,
but Leon Russell's arrnagement was the golden touch
that made the record. Love that cordovox!
Steveo
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 2
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 04:17:34 -0800 (PST)
From: Paul Bryant
Subject: Little Isidore and the Golden Inquisitors
Dear Poppers,
I asked about modern doo wop and was recommended
Little Isidore (I confess I can't recall by whom)*. But
I wanna give thanks to whoever it was, cause
"Inquisition of Love" is a great little album, which is
expertly balanced between affectionate parody and the
genuine article. It's a hard thing to do.
If anyone out these is interested in this kind of
pastiche and also interested in psychedelia, I
recommend in turn the wonderful stuff made by XTC
under the name The Dukes of Stratosphear -- they did
two vinyl lps, now condensed into one mad cd Chips From
The Chocolate Fireball. Loads of fun, I promise you.
pb
*Methinks it was the estimable Country Paul --admin
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 3
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 10:30:45 -0800 (PST)
From: Artie Wayne
Subject: Re: Songwriter credits, Ringo Starr
Paul.......Tom....How ya' doin'? I agree that Ringo should've
gotten some of the writers credit and royalties, but that's up
to the parties involved. Maybe John and Paul thought being a
drummer in the biggest group in the world was enough remuneration?
On the other side of the coin, Al Cleveland, a former writer
for Motown, told me a couple of stories. Al was out shopping
with Smokey Robinson at some dept. store when a beautiful girl
walked by. Smokey says, "M-m-m, what a fox!!", and Al
replies, "I second that emotion!!"
Another day, Al was walking down the halls of Motown, when he
heard someone playing some unearthly, compelling music on the
piano. He stuck his head in the room, saw it was his friend
Marvin Gaye and said, "What's goin' on?"
In each case, Al was rewarded with a co-writing credit on
two of Motowns biggest hits by people who knew the value of
having a great title. He also helped Smokey and Marvin finish
the songs.
What if John and Paul had encouraged Ringo to develop his writing
skills? We might have more to talk about on Spectropop.
regards,
Artie Wayne
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 4
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 04:51:45 -0000
From: Clark Besch
Subject: Re: Beatle myth/Monkees' demise
John Clemente wrote:
> With all due respect to them, I have heard members of groups
> like the Shirelles and Cleftones, who made their marks in the
> 1950s and early 60s, site Beatlemania as their downfall.
> Have you ever heard The Cleftones' 1964 single on Ware Records,
> "He's Forgotten You"? WE should forget it. What were their
> producers thinking? Product like THAT is what killed The
> Cleftones. ...
John, your comment makes me think of "what are they thinking" when
the Monkees released "D.W. Washburn". It wasn't the death of the TV
show, it wasn't "Head", it wasn't Peter leaving, it wasn't firing
Kirshner, it wasn't playing their own instruments. They were coming
off a top 10 smash, "Valleri"!!! The beginning of the end was to me,
definitely, the most lame song to come along by a top group in ages,
"D.W. Washburn". Heck, B sides like the Canadian "She Hangs Out" or even "Tapioca Tundra" would have soared above "D.W."!
Clark
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 5
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 04:42:40 -0000
From: Clark Besch
Subject: Re: Songwriter Credits, General Question
Paul Bryant wrote:
> I have a question for the songwriters amongst you.
> Some time ago Bill Wyman was trying to get some kind
> of songwriter credit for various early Jagger/Richards
> songs because he said his bass playing helped make the
> records hits (I remember 19th Nervous Breakdown was
> singled out for its diving bass runs). Was he being
> ridiculous?
I would say in the case of "19th Nevervous Breakdown" that it would
be ridiculous. I have a boot tape of the Stones playing "Diddley
Daddy" by Bo Diddley and the bass line is exactly the same as "19th,
etc". So for him to claim ownership on an exact part he stole from
Bo Diddley.......Clark
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 6
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 07:30:28 -0800 (PST)
From: Robert Beason
Subject: cigarette commercial music
Art Longmire:
> I've always been a fanatical anti-smoker, but I've
> got to admit there was a lot of great music used on
> TV ads in the days of cigarette commercials. One of
> my absolute all-time favorite tunes is "The Dis-
> Advantages of You" by the Brass Ring, used in the
> Benson and Hedges cigarette commercials.
One of my favorites, too. Is that song available on
CD? The liner notes to the Collector's Choice comp
"Instrumental Gems of the '60s" say that the compilers
wanted to include "Dis-Advantages" but couldn't find a
decent source tape, so they went with the BR's "Love
Theme From 'The Flight of the Phoenix'" instead. Too
bad!
How about the long-running "Marlboro Country"
campaign, which featured the theme from "The
Magnificent Seven"?
Bob Beason
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 7
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 10:10:17 EST
From: Bill George
Subject: Jackie DeShannon doowop records?
Someone recently wrote me asking about the following two records.
I don't know anything about them, but hopefully someone here
will (someone here always does!). I am assuming that they are
Jackie DeShannon compositions, and may be included on some
doowop compilations.
Valley High -- Bill and Doree Post (Jackie DeShannon)
I Don't Need A Diary -- Prudhomme Sisters (Jackie DeShannon)
Jackie recorded a demo called Harbor High, so this is likely
the same song. The other I've never heard of. Anyone know
anything? Thanks for the help!
Bill
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 8
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 12:11:52 -0000
From: Martin Jensen
Subject: Lou Johnson on the Bacharach box
Hi
Some time ago, I became aware of Lou Johnson via the Bacharach box.
Lou's reading of 'Reach Out for Me' and 'Always Something There to
Remind Me' just blows my mind! Incredible voice. According to
allmusic.com, Collectables issued a CD of his Big Hill '60s recordings
in the '90s, but it seems to be out of print. I can't find it
anywhere online. Does anyone here have this disc? Is it any good,
or, more to the point, do the other recordings he did for Big Hill
stand up in comparison with the ones on the abovementioned box?
I'd be interested in any info you might be able to share on this
great singer.
With regards,
Martin,
Denmark
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 9
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 21:26:18 -0500
From: Phil Milstein
Subject: Re: Burt Bacharach's poduction debut
Mick, I don't believe you ever did reveal the name of Burt Bacharach's
first production credit.
--Phil M.
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 10
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 15:11:12 -0800 (PST)
From: Stewart Mason
Subject: Anorak/skipping records
Dr. Mark posits:
> Not only ain't it being dumbed down, it's members
> are getting smartened up! I had to get out the
> Websters to look up ANORAK. I thought it must be
> a misspelled word. But no...
> anorak (ano rak) n. a heavy jacket with a hood,
> worn in the cold north
> So I assume you meant the chord references were
> a bit "heavy" or over the top for the average
> poster? Not by me.
Good guess, but "anorak" is a UK slang term roughly
analogous to "geek" in the US. I believe the term
started getting applied to pop music in the UK indie
circles of the mid-'80s, when there were a lot of
scruffy little indie guitar bands -- many of whom wore
anoraks -- whose music was supposed to hearken back to
a simpler musical time. By which they might have
meant 1977 as much as 1965.
I've often thought that the social significance of the
anorak might be related to that other often-derided UK
subculture, the trainspotters. But trainspotters are
traditionally meant to wear long brown overcoats,
aren't they?
Re "skipping" records: Help me, folks, I'm drawing a
blank! One of Mike Batt's Wombles songs had an
incredibly clever skipping gimmick that it used a
couple of times, and I can't for the life of me
remember what song it was!
S
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 11
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 22:42:57 -0000
From: ModGirl
Subject: Child is Father to the Man
Al Kooper wrote:
> BTW I just remixed CHILD IS FATHER TO THE MAN in 5.1
> Surround Sound and remastered the stereo tp SACD.
> Dont know when they'll (SONY Legacy) release it but
> it's darned good.
I am really looking forward to this!!!
Sincerely,
ModGirl
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 12
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 23:01:09 -0000
From: Ed Rambeau
Subject: Los Bravos - Make It Last
I put out feelers for some of my songs that I wrote and lost
due to my recent computer crash and just received an MP3 from
Julio Nino which I'd like to thank him for. It was the song
I wrote for Los Bravos called "Make It Last". Thanks, Julio.
There are a few others song I wrote that I'm looking for, so
if anyone has an MP3 on the following songs I would really
appreciate your emailing me a copy.
They are:
Shadows On A Foggy Day - Frank Sinatra, Jr.
Navy Blue - Susan Maughan version
Get Back In De Bed - Evan Mitchell
I also wrote a song for Patty Duke, but can't for the life
of me remember the name of it. Maybe some Spectropopper
can help me out.
If anyone has any of the above, please email me offlist.
Thanks,
Ed Rambeau
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 13
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 23:29:06 -0000
From: Phil Hall
Subject: My Name Is Mud
To Ed Rambeau:
My best friend in high school was Robert O'Gwynn, and his
father, James O'Gwynn had a moderately big country & western
hit in 1962 called "My Name Is Mud". Is it the same song as
yours?
Thanks,
Phil Hall
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 14
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 00:04:30 -0000
From: Billy G Spradlin
Subject: Re: varispeed listening
I heard a couple stations that played "Imaginary Lover"
sped up, mostly during the morning show.
In 1984 a few stations were playing Bruce Springsteen's
"I'm On Fire" LP cut at 45 for kicks, it strangly sounded
like Dolly Parton!
I also recall when the Chipmunk's "Chipmunk Punk" album came
out in 1981. It was the 'munks covering new wave hits from
that era (Blondie's "Call Me", The Knack's "My Sharona", The
Cars "Lets Go"). Their record company released a promo 45
which my College Radio station added to the Top 40 rotation
for fun. It was also a lot of fun to watch beginning DJ's
freak out thinking they had put the record on the wrong speed!
Billy
http://listen.to/jangleradio
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 15
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 00:41:04 -0000
From: Trevor Ley
Subject: Re: Beatle Myth
Doc Rock wrote:
> PS The Beatles LOVED American early '60s music!
To which Tom Taber replied:
> Haven't we all met a Beatles fan who loves everything
> they ever recorded, and at best is indifferent to, and
> at worst loathes, anything from the Brill Building?
> I'll never understand it.
I'd say we have to blame youth for that kind of narrowness and the
unfortunate need to "compartmentalize". Like how I ignored big band,
Sinatra and such in the 60's as my Dad's horribly unhip and outdated
junk. Now I collect it. I caught on very early how much of Beatle
harmonies sounded like Everlys.
Also recall in late 70's album rock radio how uncool it was to admit
you loved Beach Boys. "Sailor" LP and that period made so many of us
realize we'd been 'closet' BB fans all the time. Seems like often
things have to get repackaged by someone in our own cultural niche to
appreciate their influences. I investigted BB King becasue my hero,
Clapton. How many Journey fans can hear ho well Steve Perry "did"
Sam Cooke?
Trevor Ley
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 16
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 23:47:30 -0000
From: Billy G Spradlin
Subject: Re: Spine Shiverers / Big Finishes
John Sellards wrote:
> How about Billy Stewart's vocal ending on Summertime
> (for that matter his whole vocal)?
I always liked the way Stewart took the line "Your mama's rich" and
strectched it into "Your mama's rich--sonoffab*tch".
Billy
http://listen.to/jangleradio
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 17
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 17:39:13 -0800 (PST)
From: David Coyle
Subject: Japanese Lyrics to "Sukiyaki"
Does anyone know where I might find the Japanese
lyrics to "Sukiyaki" by Ryu Sakamoto, spelled out
phonetically? I've always thought it would be a hoot
to do a cover of this song.
David
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 18
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 01:11:38 -0000
From: Trevor Ley
Subject: Re: Joe Butler and Zally
Mike wrote:
> No one's yet mentioned Joe Butler's other great Spoonful
> moment, "Butchie's Tune." That's always been my favorite
> -- not only for Joe's heartfelt vocal, but also Zally's
> incredibly tasty tremolo country licks.
Mike,
Right, great song. Butler also did the vocal on a great version
of "You Baby" and always thought his smooth, almost crooner type
voice filled out the bg harmonies on things like "You Didn't Have
to be So Nice".
BTW saw Sebastian at an outdoor "Taste of Dallas" event a few
years ago, with Fritz Richmond and some of the other old cronies.
Of course, the whole crowd sings along with "Daydream" and the
other hits. I think he was taken aback with this weirdo leaning
against a tree who knew ALL the lyrics like "I was down in Savannah,
eatin' cream and bananas when the heat just made me faint"
Trevor
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 19
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 01:11:43 -0000
From: Ian Chapman
Subject: Patty Michaels
Phil Milstein played a '72 version of "Tar & Cement" by Patricia Ann
Michaels to musica and wrote:
> The jury is still out on whether Patricia Ann Michaels is the same
> singer as Patty Michaels……..
Who better to ask than Patty Michaels herself? I posed that question
to her and at the same time asked for a little background on her 60s
career to share with the gang at Spectropop - which she's checked out
and loves, BTW. Patty was both touched and amazed that her records
are remembered. Here's some of her reply:
*******
"I'm still in shock; I never thought anybody heard my records, I
thought they stayed on the shelf....as I said, I had bad managers and
bad promoters; they never did anything with my songs, except the
William Morris agency booked me on 'Shindig!', 'Where the Action Is'
and a couple of other rock shows. And yes, Helen Miller produced my
song 'They're Dancing Now.'"
"That has to be another singer, the 'Tar & Cement' song – I'm not the
Patricia Michaels on it."
"I was an original Murray the K dancer and singer in New York, when I
was a kid. In the 60s I worked with the Animals, the Moody Blues,
Graham Nash, the Nashville Teens, the Rolling Stones, Freddie and the
Dreamers and Herman's Hermits....and all the American groups. We did
all the TV specials with all the groups, and did all the holiday
shows at the Brooklyn Fox theatre. I still have a teen magazine I
was in from the 60s; it says 'My date with Paul McCartney'!!"
"I'd love for you to pass this on to the guys at Spectropop. This is
unbelievable......"
*******
Patty may join the Spectropop ranks at some point - her mom's very
ill in hospital right now - but if anybody has any questions for
Patty in the meantime, post away and I'll pass them on and relay her
replies.
Ian
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 20
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 17:01:01 -0800 (PST)
From: Steve Harvey
Subject: That Alan Gordon
There is some info here on Bonner and Gordon from one
of Dawn's older interviews:
http://dawneden.com/blogger.html
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 21
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 00:14:01 -0000
From: Billy G Spradlin
Subject: Re: Songs that "quote" others
How about Alex Chilton mentioning the blues classic (dont know the
original artist) "You Left The Water Running" at the end of the Box
Tops "Cry Like a Baby"?
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 22
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 02:51:29 -0000
From: C Ponti
Subject: Re: Boone & Sebastian & Dylan
Al Kooper wrote:
> The pre Beatles college kid in Al Kooper's post is actually
> Steve Boone. Went to the session with John S. and ended up
> playing on two or three cuts.
> What about the photos of Sebastian playing bass? Are you saying
> that it's not Sebastian? I think not. WHAT trax did Steve Boone
> play on? I know of none that were released.
Al,
The pics were of John, trust me. Remember the inspiraton for "House
In The Country"?
C Pont
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 23
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 21:02:46 -0500
From: Country Paul
Subject: Royal Teens; Bobby Vee; JFK & the Beatles
Al Kooper:
> I did my time in The Royal Teens. Starting in 1958 at the ripe old age
> of fourteen. Bob Gaudio and Leo Rogers gave me my pro start!!! The sax
> player of note was titled Larry Qualiano - he played the parts on the
> records. A 16-17 year old Jersey lad. Hope this helps.
Sure does. You guys were good! Thanks, Al.
Doc Rock wrote:
> Bobby Vee and I have discussed how 99% of his fans in
> the old days were female. Now 99% are male!
Bob "Veefriend":
> Over on the Bobby Vee Collectors Club Yahoo group I have roughly
> 88% men and the balance women as members. I think nowadays, most
> men that are Bobby Vee fans are into collecting his records.
I got into Bobby Vee with "Laurie My Darling" and love his
country-rockabilly side. Frankly, when new I tolerated some of the pop hits
(didn't like "Run To Him" but loved "Rubber Ball") and very much liked his
Crickets period and his British Invasion sound ("Look At Me, Girl"). The
capper was the Robert Thomas Velline album, which proved his credibility as
an overall musician, as if it needed further proof. Check out "Every
Opportunity" and Buck (Ronny Daytona) Wilkin's "My God and I" to hear where
Buddy Holly might have gone, and where Bobby Vee did indeed go. (He also did
a great phone interview with me at WHCN when that album came out - a real
gentleman.) I think if guys of the era got to his music early, they probably
stayed with him through the "chick" songs. I know that for me it was a
musical journey worth taking.
Paul Bryant:
> What still, perhaps, needs to be explained
> is why it took America so long (one whole year) to catch up on
> them - when the first 4 singles were released in 63 Americans
> ignored them - and why only a few months later in January 64
> the whole country went completely mad for them. I have heard
> the old theory about it being something to do with JFK - the
> Beatles were giving American youth the excuse to have a good
> time after weeks of national grieving - but I don't know if I
> buy that.
Paul, buy it. I was 18 when JFK was shot and I remember the day better than
much more recewnt stuff. After an incredible funk that the country was in,
we were ready for something. Also, the steady diet of "sugar" on pop radio
was ready for something harder and better. Such records were lurking beneath
the surface (check 1963's Ronnie Hawkins & The Hawks "Bo Diddley"/"Who Do
Your Love" for a low-charting but kick-butt track driven by some future
major players) but till the Beatles revealed themselves, there was no
galvanizing personality (or in this case, personalities) to lead the
emotional recovery. (I tell a story earlier in the archives about a Murray
The K Record Review Board in July '63 with Del Shannon and the Beatles in
competitive voting - Shannon got hundreds, the Beatles were in the single
digits.)
Country Paul
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 24
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 02:25:53 -0000
From: Mark Frumento
Subject: The Mary Hopkin Song Contest
There an interesting little story in Stefan Granados' 'Unofficial
History of Apple'. Apparently (if I'm telling the story correctly)
Paul McCartney held a contest among the writers signed to Apple
publishing. The winner would get their song released as the B-side
of "Goodbye." The story goes that the band Mortimer submitted a
track among others who also submitted tracks. In the end, of course,
the winner was the amazing "Sparrow" by Gallager and Lyle.
And that leads me to this... Mary's interpretations of Gallager and
Lyles tunes are among my favorite tracks by her. I have a video of
he singing "International" that is simply stunning.
I could also go on about her versions of Ralph McTell's "Kew
Gardens" (never heard a bad versions of that song) and "Silver Birch
and Weeping Willow".
Mark Frumento
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 25
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 22:16:33 -0000
From: Art Longmire
Subject: Re: Unchained Melody
Phil Milstein wrote:
> An absolutely fascinating interview with "Hy Zaret", who
> wrote the lyric to "Unchained Melody" at age 16 (with Der
> Bingle in mind)... can be found at:
Mick Patrick replied:
> Talking of "Unchained Melody", it seems Al Hibbler had to
> battle it out with Les Baxter, whose version actually outsold
> his, reaching #1 on the Billboard chart. That great balladeer
> Roy Hamilton also did very well with his reading that same year,
> 1955, as did June Valli with hers. The song was a hit again in
> 1963 for Vito & the Salutations (great), in 1968 for the Sweet
> Inspirations (even better) and in 1981 for Heart (barf!). Sorry
> if anyone's already said all this.
Yet another great version of this is the one by Patti Labelle and the
Bluebelles on Atlantic from 1965, produced by Bert Berns. I have a
promotional copy of this and unbelievably, it's listed as the B-side.
I remember seeing the movie "Unchained" back in the late 80's on
television and being somewhat surprised that there was no vocal
version of the song included, just an orchestral theme.
Art Longmire
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
SPECTROPOP - Spectacular! Retro! Pop!
End
