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Volume #0011 11/12/97
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Subject: Less known writers, Honeys, Girl Groups
Sent: 11/11/97 4:20 AM
Received: 11/11/97 7:39 AM
From: carol knudson, knudXXX@XXXXXXolumbia.edu
To: Spectropop List, spectroXXX@XXXXXXies.com
Hi all,
OK, I've got a few questions, but first let me start by
saying thanks to Jamie and Jack for inviting me to the
list. At last!!, a place I can talk about the music of
my life with out getting totally put down by all my Pink
Floyd/Led Zeppelin head friends at home. (Not that I
don't like that stuff too, but, you know...)
So, first- a song writer I have come across recently
(though I bet he's not unknown to the experts on this
list :)) is Gary Zekley. Aside from "Yellow Balloon", I
have found several tunes by him, but would love to hear
more! Anyone know anything about him? He's also
responsible for the song "Cause I Love Him" sung by
Alder Ray-WOW!!! This is the closest I have ever heard
to a Phil Spector production without actually being one
(at least I don't *think* it is). I haven't been able to
find any more from her, though- does anyone know of
anything else she does?
As for the Honeys, Yes I'd have to agree, much as I like
the beings of Marilyn and Diane, they are not the
singers that Ginger is. I kinda like hearing them though,
it gives me a homey feeling to think of Brian working
with them. And speaking of Ginger- I just came across
"Growing Up Is Hard To Do" (by Ginger and the Snaps)
which I hadn't heard before- Great Tune!!
Another recent find is "Golly Gee" by Sheila North.
Another great song, in the Patience and Prudence vein.
In talking about New 'Girl Group' sounding tunes- these
songs may not 'count' cause they're not like real
out-on-the-radio songs, but "I Do" and "Born To Love
That Boy" from the "Grace of My Heart" Soundtrack are
both wonderful songs, and probably as close as we can
get to that sound these days.
Thanks for the info about the Flower Pot Men, guys! I'll
have to seek them out- I LOVE the other tunes mentioned
that the members were involved with- This list is great!
CAROL
-----------[ archived by Spectropop ]-----------
Subject: The Honeys and Spring
Sent: 11/11/97 10:11 AM
Received: 11/12/97 1:05 AM
From: Brad Elliott, surfXXX@XXXXXXline.net
To: Spectropop Mailing List, spectroXXX@XXXXXXies.com
Jamie LePage wrote:
> In Brad Elliott's book "Surf's Up!" he mentions Collection
> Series, saying that Vol. 2 was the Honeys: The Definite
> Album. Brad goes on to say that only 150 copies were pressed
> and that a second run was re-booted but in what number is not
> mentioned. Now, I don't know what all that means, but my
> Honeys box is called the Honeys: The Definite Album, Vol. 3
> (pictured in Surf's Up!). To confuse matters, there is a
> sticker on the plastic slip case that says: Beach Boys
> Collector's Series Vol. 2, with a hand written number 120 on
> it. Whassup with dat? What are the differences between the
> first and second run, and what are "Definite Albums 1 & 2"?
> If my copy is a first run, can I sell it and buy a house in
> Malibu?
Okay, let me try to clear this confusion up. (Thanks a
lot, Peter!)
There were five released volumes of the Beach Boys
Collector's Series:
Vol. 1 -- Bob & Sheri: "The Surfer Moon" b/w "Humpty Dumpty" (45)
Vol. 2 -- The Honeys: THE DEFINITE ALBUM, VOL. 3 (LP)
Vol. 3 -- The Beach Boys: THE HAWTHORNE HOTSHOTS (2 EPs)
Vol. 4 -- The Beach Boys: SMILE front cover print
Vol. 5 -- The Beach Boys: SMILE back cover print
As to why the Honeys album was titled THE DEFINITE ALBUM,
VOL. 3: This was a play on a couple of European Beach
Boys releases that could be easily found at the time.
THE DEFINITE ALBUM was a "best of" of late 1960s tracks.
ANOTHER DEFINITE ALBUM was a compilation of the best
tracks from SUNFLOWER and SURF'S UP.
Is that clear?
By the way, what you're describing sure sounds like a
first run copy. The second run was not done by the
original bootlegger and was not numbered. (And I still
don't know how many copies were done of the second run!)
Jamie also wrote:
> Then there was the American Spring reunion thing circa 1980,
> which I think ended up being released on Rhino or something.
> But I remember the demo listed the cover of Romeo and Juliet
> as being "Music Produced and Arranged by Brian Wilson" (what
> does that mean?), with a mix note that read:
>
> "Recording Produced by American Spring and mixed by Dan
> Phillips and David Scott through Deep Sleep Productions, in
> association with Phil Spector International Inc.)" !!!!
>
> So, can Messrs. Phillips and Scott be anyone other than the
> Kessel Kids?
Yes, Phillips and Scott are the sons of Barney Kessel. Deep Sleep
Productions was their own company, which they apparently operated under
the auspices of PSI.
> something like gun toting L.A. pop icon godfather
> quasi-bodyguards cum record producers of the late 70's
Yeah, that's a pretty good description of the situation!
As for the 1977-79 American Spring recordings, Brian did
indeed produce several of them -- "It's Like Heaven," "Do
Ya" and "Romeo and Juliet" -- and, if the liner notes to
the Capitol HONEYS CD are to be believed, "Don't Be Cruel."
(But there are a number of known errors in those liner
notes and I definitely remember being told about 1980
that "DBC" was NOT a Brian production. It doesn't sound
much like one, either.) BTW, all four of these tracks
are included on Capitol's now out-of-print Honeys CD in
versions that have had Ginger Blake's backing vocals
overdubbed to make them "real" Honeys recordings. (And
because the recordings have been remixed by Ron Furmanek,
there is no credit to the Kessel boys.)
Finally, there's another American Spring recording from
about that time that was not included on the Capitol CD
that I've always thought probably is a Brian production
-- "My Boyfriend's Back." It sure sounds a LOT like
their version of "Romeo and Juliet"!
>> The Beach Boys could go into a studio today and cut "She's
>> A Doll" or "Pamela Lee"
>
> OK, I give up. What is Pamela Lee? Are we talking Survivors here?
I think somebody suggested that they should re-record
"Pamela Jean" as "Pamela Lee" and tie it into Baywatch.
But I don't remember who. (It wasn't me!)
Surf's up!
Brad
-----------[ archived by Spectropop ]-----------
Subject: Things You Don't Miss
Sent: 11/11/97 3:04 AM
Received: 11/11/97 7:39 AM
From: David Marsteller, davebXXX@XXXXXXlin.org
I know we all tend to feel nostalgic about the 'glory
days' of songwriting, but are there any features of
songs from that period that you don't miss? I can think
of one. I call it the backhanded compliment song.
Examples would be Mary Wells' (really Smokey Robinson's)
"My Guy" or Jackie Wilson's (I think) "You Got What It
Takes". These are songs where the basic point is 'you're
not good looking (or rich etc) but you're great for me'.
Can't think of anyone who'd want to have a song like
that addressed to them...
Later
Dave
-----------[ archived by Spectropop ]-----------
Subject: Three Dog Night hits
Sent: 11/10/97 9:37 AM
Received: 11/11/97 2:14 AM
From: Marc Wielage, XXX@XXXXXXrax.com
Don Richardson <drichXXX@XXXXXXco> commented:
> ...Going against the norm of the time, they instead sought
> out the best >songs written by others and had more top 40, top
> 10, and number 1 songs >than any other American artist between
> 1969 and 1974.
------------------------<snip>------------------------
Possibly for Top 10 and Top 40, but not for #1. Three
Dog Night had only three #1 hits from 1969-1974, matched
by The Temptations. But The Jackson 5 had *five* #1's
during that period, if you include their double-sided
hits (four if you only count that record as 1 hit).
--MFW
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
= Marc Wielage | XXX@XXXXXXet.com =
= MusicTrax, Ltd. | CompuServe's CENETWORK: 76702,1025 =
= Chatsworth, CA | AOL: mtrax6 =
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-----------[ archived by Spectropop ]-----------
Subject: Could Phil Spector score a hit today?
Sent: 11/12/97 0:19 AM
Received: 11/12/97 0:21 AM
From: Jamie LePage, le_page_XXX@XXXXXXies.com
Javed asks:
> Could Phil Spector score a hit today?
Well, if you look at Ghosts, and depending on your
definition of "today," he DID score a big hit today, with
a thirty year old master, and the Righteous Brothers,
trying to cash in on the success of the Spector track,
recut the song using state-of-the-art studio technology
and ended up embarrassing themselves by failing to come up
with anything nearly as moving as the side Spector had cut
thirty years before on comparatively limited recording
equipment.
Here's a question maybe someone can answer. Two or three
years ago, Phil Spector was cutting in the studio with the
Wrecking Crew. I believe it was Ocean Way. It was learned
that he was tracking for Celine Dion (!). When Dion's
latest album was released, it included a cover of River
Deep, Mountain High, the Mother Bertha/Trio song first cut
by Tina Turner for Philles. Mother Bertha is Allen Klein
o/b/o Phil Spector, Trio is Leiber/Stoller o/b/o
Barry/Greenwich. So, figuring Spector must have worked on
River Deep, Mountain High, I checked the credits. Not a
single mention of Phil or the Wrecking Crew. I listened.
Not a sign. Checking a bit more closely, I discovered that
the lyrics to every song were printed in the CD booklet,
except for River Deep Mountain High. No Phil, no Wrecking
Crew, no lyric...Hmmm.
Any ideas why the Spector dates were scrapped?
LePageWeb
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