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Always handle records like this - without touching the playing surfaces.
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There are 21 messages in this issue of Spectropop.
Topics in this Digest Number 393:
1. John Simon/shoddy reissues/4 Seasons/Jay & the Americans
From: "Paul Payton"
2. Re: The hipness of Frankie Valli...Grease...disco era
From: "Robert Conway"
3. Teardrops CD
From: "Ian Slater"
4. Teardrops CD
From: John Clemente
5. Re:Tokens Fans?
From: James Botticelli
6. a bit twisted
From: James Botticelli
7. Re: C'mon Marianne
From: "Robert Beason"
8. Dusty Sings The Blues
From: "Don Charles"
9. Re: C'mon Marianne
From: Mark Frumento
10. Re: Any Tokens Fans?
From: Mark Frumento
11. Isleys
From: "John Lester"
12. Shangri Las pics wanted for next Actionettes Extravaganza...
From: Delia Barnard
13. Randy & The Rainbows
From: Mark Frumento
14. Re: it ain't exactly country
From: Lindsay Martin
15. The Packers Hole In The Wall
From: John Briggs
16. crossing over into psychedelia
From: Alan Zweig
17. The Liquid Room
From: "David Ponak"
18. The Shillings
From: "Kingsley Abbott"
19. Four Seasons, Tokens, Association
From: "Kingsley Abbott"
20. Re: Association hits package issues
From: Jason Penick
21. Risa Potters
From: "Ken Levine"
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Message: 1
Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 19:46:05 -0500
From: "Paul Payton"
Subject: John Simon/shoddy reissues/4 Seasons/Jay & the Americans
Harvey Williams wrote:
> "My Name Is Jack" is indeed a smashing record,
> bettered only by "The Wabe". As far as I'm aware,
> both numbers can only be found on the soundtrack LP
> for the movie "You Are What You Eat", although there
> was a promo 45 of both songs released too.
Missed that one!
> Has anyone seen the film? I've not, but the "plot"
> synopsis (I use the term loosely) in the liner notes
> makes it sound like a real..er..trip. Did John Simon
> release any other solo records around this time?
Never saw the movie but he was a producer of
significant note in the 60's. Can anyone offer more
about him and his productions?
Bob Conway wrote:
> ...Association [best-of]..."No Fair at All," a great
> harmony-laden ballad, is not included. Comments on
> rationale anyone?
You said it best, Bob: "Obviously it is all about sucking
in another consumer/fan to make money." How badly did you
say/do they think you want the missing track?
Mark Frumento wrote:
> It seems to me that because FV&TFS were caught between
> the harmony group (i.e. Doo-Wop) scene and the rock and
> roll scene they fell throught the cracks.
I respectfully disagree, Mark. They had bubbling-under
stuff in the 50's (as the Four Lovers), and were one of
the most innovative Top 40's groups in the pre-British
Invasion 60's. That they lasted into it so long, but were
a Top 40 group in the time of great schism between 45's
and 33's, "limited" their post-'64 audience to that "AM"
audience. That they came back with their "Who Loves You"
era and following - and were acknowledged by the album
radio crowd - speaks of great acceptance. Perhaps Bob
Crewe may not feel compelled to reveal his creative
process to the world. Maybe he doesn't believe there's
enough interest in it for him to put in the effort of
organizing his thoughts and experiences in a book.
And yes, the Seasons did take that misstep (in my opinion,
although not in those of some others on this list) into
progressive rock with "Genuine Imitation Life," but they
weren't the only 50's-60's artists caught up in the
maelstrom who tried to "stay hip." Credit the Seasons for
trying - and for coming back true to themselves and
having great success with it. I think Valli's solo hits
confirm that he was a pop guy, not a progressive guy -
and there's nothing wrong with that, it's just a
statement of what I regard as fact.
Mike A. wrote:
> Remember Jay and The Americans Greatest Hits? It didnt
> have "She Cried", not only their FIRST hit but a biggie.
Might have been because the changed "Jays" right after it
- same (stage) name, different singer. (And "She Cried"
is my total fave J&A's song ever. Truly Spectorian in
concept, as well as "borrowing" the kettledrums from the
Drifters' "There Goes My Baby.")
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Message: 2
Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 03:48:54 -0600
From: "Robert Conway"
Subject: Re: The hipness of Frankie Valli...Grease...disco era
I never thought of the Seasons as hip...they looked like
neighborhood guys. You mention a late entry in the
Frankie Valli catalog. I suggest "Grease" was one of
Frankie's latest and greatest...seventies culture backdrop
factored into the equation.
Back to the hip look...the disco era would have been an
opportune time for FV/Seasons to try to reconnect and look
cool. It could have worked plus they wouldn't have had to
compete against the British Invasion and later the
singer-songwriter, folk-rock scene. They would have looked
seventies chic in Travolta-like polyester and with
long-sprayed hair (although I'd say most of the group was
either thinning or balding by the late seventies). -Bob
Conway
Javed wrote:
> > > The Four Seasons did record one "serious" 60's type
> > > album called "Genuine Imitation Life Gazette" and they
> > > even tried to look a bit hipper on the cover of that
> > > one.
>
Paul Payton wrote:
> > (And the hair was long, but not hip; you could
> > tell. Really.) Progressive rock stations avoided it in
> > droves - we could smell a shuck when we saw one
Billy G. Spradlin wrote:
>I thought it was strange on Rhino's re-issue back in
>the early 90's used a different photograph on the cover,
>removing the staged protest rally photos. If you get a
>chance to see the original gatefold cover its a hoot.
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Message: 3
Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 09:51:12 -0000
From: "Ian Slater"
Subject: Teardrops CD
Simon White wrote:
> I've been told that a Teardrops cd has been released
> but I can find nothing. Obviously I have left some
> stones unturned although I thought I had left no stone
> unturned. Anyone ?
The CD was published privately by the group's original
writer:
Paul Trefzger
Saxony Record Company
85 Duboce Avenue #301
San Francisco,
California 94103
I bought mine last October. It contains 11 tracks -
including all the girls' Musicor & Saxony singles.
Ian Slater
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Message: 4
Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 13:35:42 -0500
From: John Clemente
Subject: Teardrops CD
Hello All,
In response to Simon White's mention of the Teardrops CD,
you can order it from their original record company,
Saxony Records. The site is: http://www.saxonyrecordcompany.com.
The Teardrops and their songwriter and owner of Saxony
Records, Paul Trefzger, were gracious enough to sponsor a
book signing for me last June in Cincinnati, their home
town. We had a blast! These ladies can sure sing!
Regards,
John Clemente
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Message: 5
Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 13:38:29 EST
From: James Botticelli
Subject: Re:Tokens Fans?
In a message dated Fri, 22 Feb 2002, "DJ Steve" writes:
> Out there? I bet you are from Brooklyn. I really love
> their 1st album with The Lion Sleeps Tonight and all
> those good doo-wopy folky songs like Sloop John B. Is it
> on CD yet? How about Neil Sedaka from the Brill Building?
> Gotta love his early writing. Anyone read his auto- bio?
> Does he mention the Tokens?
I'm actually from Boston. "Its A Happening World" is my
fave by those guys...They're big in Japan as well. The
Japanese re-released the "happening world" LP onto a CD
format.
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Message: 6
Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 13:42:34 EST
From: James Botticelli
Subject: a bit twisted
> > > The Four Seasons did record one "serious" 60's type
> > > album called "Genuine Imitation Life Gazette" and they
> > > even tried to look a bit hipper on the cover of that
> > > one.
This may sound a bit twisted, but in hindsight I like the
failed efforts and phony attempts to cash in on the
zeitgeist of 1968-71 more than I like the "real" stuff
which to me comes across as often as not as overblown
arrogant elitist spoiled brat stuff...
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Message: 7
Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 15:43:22 +0000
From: "Robert Beason"
Subject: Re: C'mon Marianne
David Gordon wrote:
>Something I don't think I've ever seen mentioned is
>that the intro. to "Touch Me" by the Doors is a
>straight steal from "C'mon Marianne.
So is the intro to Lauryn Hill's version of "Can't Take
My Eyes Off You".
Bob Beason
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Message: 8
Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 19:33:32 +0000
From: "Don Charles"
Subject: Dusty Sings The Blues
A correction to the songwriter information I posted for
Dusty Springfield's unreleased 1971 album: "All The
King's Horses" is definitely NOT the same song that
Aretha Franklin released a year later. It was probably
(but unconfirmedly) penned by Neil Goldberg, one of Jeff
Barry's most prolific staff writers.
Don Charles
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Message: 9
Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 19:54:33 -0000
From: Mark Frumento
Subject: Re: C'mon Marianne
--- In spectropop, David Gordon wrote:
> Something I don't think I've ever seen mentioned is
> that the intro. to "Touch Me" by the Doors is a
> straight steal from "C'mon Marianne"
I have read that observation somewhere but I forget
which compliation. Of course the similarity is right in
your face and a great, totally amazing FV4S song.
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Message: 10
Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 19:57:10 -0000
From: Mark Frumento
Subject: Re: Any Tokens Fans?
"DJ Steve" wrote:
> Out there? I bet you are from Brooklyn. I really love
> their 1st album with The Lion Sleeps Tonight and all
> those good doo-wopy folky songs like Sloop John B. Is it
> on CD yet? How about Neil Sedaka from the Brill Building?
> Gotta love his early writing. Anyone read his auto- bio?
> Does he mention the Tokens?
Count me in. However I am rather confused about their
history (just haven't taken the time to read about them).
One of my favorite albums of all times is "Intercourse".
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Message: 11
Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 22:34:33 -0000
From: "John Lester"
Subject: Isleys
Billy G. Spradlin wrote:
> From what (little) I have read about the Isleys, they
> were treated as second-class outsiders (not being from
> Detroit) and didn't like the label's "production line"
> treatment. The group signed to Motown to keep thier
> career going, but they didnt always get the best songs
> and production teams.
Response:
I guess the likes of Holland Dozier Holland and Ivy
Hunter are second rate producers then as are second rate
songs in the guise of I Heard It Thru The Grapevine,
Behind A Painted Smile and This Old Heart Of Mine. Jeez!
David Feldman wrote:
> You imply that the instrumental track for the Isley's
> version still exists. Does it resemble the slower groove
> of Marvin Gaye's version or the GK&P's?
Response:
The band track exists......it's likely to be Smokey's
version ..but don't quote me on that.
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Message: 12
Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 10:50:21 -0000
From: Delia Barnard
Subject: Shangri Las pics wanted for next Actionettes Extravaganza...
Howdy Spectropoppers,
All girl dance troupe The Actionettes (www.actionettes.com)
for more info.... are doing a tribute to The Shangri-Las
for their next club night. Was wondering if anyone had any
cool pics of the ladies OR the man himself Shadow Morton
that we can use as decoration (in our usual photocopied
and prittsticked style...) any help much appreciated! our
last night (a Dusty special!) went very well and i
heartily recommend Emma Wilkinson if any of you get a
chance to see her perform 'as dusty'
x Delia x
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Message: 13
Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 01:50:27 -0000
From: Mark Frumento
Subject: Randy & The Rainbows
Mention of the Tokens and The Four Seasons brings to mind
one of the lost groups of the early to mid-60s. R&TR
somehow survived that late Doo-Wop period and released
some great vocal harmony/pop material. If it's still in
print get their one and only CD, 'Better Than Ever'.
"Denise" is certainly a masterwork but by 1965 or so they
had some more great material like "Bonnie's Part of Town"
(written by none other than Dickie Lee). The Tokens wrote
some of their material as well. By the late 70s they
recorded some material for Ambient. "Strike It Rich" is a
fabulous hooky song that could have been a hit the 60s.
Pure pop with a bit of vocal harmony thrown in. Vocally
they seemed to be quite versitile and they do not come
off as a Doo-Wop group attempting to sound pop as the 60s
moved on.
I'd be real curious if anyone else out there is familiar
with this CD.... what do you think?
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Message: 14
Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 21:39:02 -0000
From: Lindsay Martin
Subject: Re: it ain't exactly country
Michael Rashkow wrote:
> Misty...it ain't exactly country
It's one of those songs that reinforces my theory that if
something is really good it transcends genre; you're not
thinking about which pigeon-hole it belongs in, you're
too busy digging it.
Lindsay
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Message: 15
Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 20:37:11 -0000
From: John Briggs
Subject: The Packers Hole In The Wall
The story of this marvelous instro was provided in the 3
disc "Time Is Tight" boxed set of Booker T and the MG's.
The band was in Los Angeles backing several of the
Stax/Volt artists on tour. A local DJ, the Magnificent
Montague, ended up with a couple of their jams on tape...
added the fake audience sounds on his own initiative...
released the song on his own label.... Quite a shock for
Booker T and the guys when it became a hit. The boxed
set release was the first time it had ever been released
credited to the proper individuals.
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Message: 16
Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 16:20:27 -0500
From: Alan Zweig
Subject: crossing over into psychedelia
>
>> > The Four Seasons did record one "serious" 60's type
>> > album called "Genuine Imitation Life Gazette" and they
>> > even tried to look a bit hipper on the cover of that
>> > one.
>>
>> ...which, IMO and the opinions of many others I knew,
>> represented some of their lesser and most "strapped on"
>> output. (And the hair was long, but not hip; you could
>> tell. Really.)
I don't have to mention hair length to say that I have a
particular interest in records made in the "psychedelic
era" by artists from the early sixties. Artists who you
might not have thought would be able to "cross over". I
just got that Four Seasons CD reissue and I love it. I
also really like the Del Shannon CD "The Adventures of
Charles Westover". I first got interested in such records
through Tommy Roe's psychedelic record, pointed out to me
by JimmyB. And Keith also did one. And I have a record by
Bobby Vee that I think, falls into this category. But some
of them are more interesting than successful. I think the
Del Shannon one is a legitimately fine record. And maybe
the Four Seasons too.
And that brings up a topic, I'm sure some of you will have
insight on. Bob Gaudio. I know he did all the Four Seasons
records. But he also did one of my favorite records.
Frank Sinatra's "Watertown". I should probably point out
that I grew up hating Sinatra. And that might help explain
why all my favorite Sinatra records now, are the ones that
Sinatra fans thumb their noses at. Not just Watertown but
also the one he did with Rod McKuen, which I genuinely
love. Anyway Watertown is a brilliant record and it makes
me wonder if perhaps Mr. Gaudio doesn't get enough credit
as the genius he may have been.
Any other Watertown fans here?
Any insights into Gaudio?
AZ
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Message: 17
Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 15:13:41 -0800
From: "David Ponak"
Subject: The Liquid Room
The Liquid Room, (usually) hosted by David Ponak (me),
airs every Saturday night from Midnight to 3AM (PDT) on
90.7FM KPFK Los Angeles, as well as streaming at
http://kpfk.org.
This weekend my very special guest will be Terry Kirkman,
founding member of the Association, and writer of such
classics as "Cherish," "Everything That Touches You,"
and "Requiem For The Masses."
KPFK is also having it's fund-drive, so this is a good
chance to show support for the Liquid Room. Premiums
will include Rhino's "Just The Right Sound-The
Association Anthology" and many other goodies.
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Message: 18
Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 20:41:26 -0000
From: "Kingsley Abbott"
Subject: The Shillings
Pardon me if this has been asked before, but can anyone
tell me the story behind The Shillings "Just For You Baby"
(US Fontana F-1543)? Produced by Wes Farrell, it is the
Ronettes' "You Baby" song with just Mann/Weil writing
credits, and is a male harmony-ish group. It's was good
one to find - just last week on the island of Jersey!
When did it emerge relative to the Ronettes version??
Kingsley Abbott
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Message: 19
Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 21:32:15 -0000
From: "Kingsley Abbott"
Subject: Four Seasons, Tokens, Association
Four Seasons discussion...For what it's worth I adore
"Genuine Imitation Life Gazette" and rate it in my top
ten 60s albums. So much so that I managed to convince
Mojo to let me write a 'buried treasure' piece on it.
During my interview with Mr gaudio about it, we talked of
other seasonish things (there are practically no outakes
BTW) and we both expressed a great liking for "Everybody
Knows My Name" from the "Working My Way Back To You"
album. Strangely enough Mr G had been talking about that
very track to Mr Valli a few days before!
Tokens...Love em! Especially Jay Siegal's falsetto!
There are a couple of tasty reissues around the UK at the
moment, originating from New York.
Association...any chance that someone could give an idea
of how many, if any, unreleased/rare tracks there are
amid the 50 tracks. Would be helpful to know before
ordering 'blind' over here...thanks!
Kingsley Abbott
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Message: 20
Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 16:40:34 EST
From: Jason Penick
Subject: Re: Association hits package issues
Bob Conway wrote;
> Not so..."No Fair at All," a great
> harmony-laden ballad, is not included. Comments on
> rationale anyone?
I can't explain it, but I think it was even crazier to
leave of the fantastic "Dubuque Blues", another great
single. Then they included "Yes I Will", a single from
the same album, that IMHO is a far lesser track than
either "Dubuque" or "No Fair". Still worth getting for
the unreleased track, though!
Jason
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Message: 21
Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 00:01:32 -0800
From: "Ken Levine"
Subject: Risa Potters
Does anybody remember a late 60's folk singer named Risa
Potters? Had an album on Elektra. Would love to get a
copy of it and have always wondered whatever became of
her. If anyone would know it would be one of you guys.
I'm forever amazed.
Ken
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