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SPECTROPOP - Spectacular! Retro! Pop!
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There are 19 messages in this issue.
Topics in this digest:
1. Re: Bad Rhymes
From: Ian Slater
2. Re: Orpheus
From: Art
3. Re: Best Lines
From: Art
4. Re: Bad Lines
From: Rex Strother
5. Re: Claire
From: Ian Chippett
6. Re: Orpheus
From: Mark Frumento
7. Re: Bad Lines
From: John Fox
8. Re: Lovin' Spoonful
From: Steve Harvey
9. Re: Snuff Garrett
From: Bob
10. Re: Bad Lines / Good Lines
From: Artie Wayne
11. Re: Snuff Garrett & "Strings"
From: Artie Wayne
12. Re: Crooners
From: Artie Wayne
13. Re: Bad Lines & Rhymes
From: Mike McKay
14. Re: Bad Lines
From: Tom Taber
15. Re: Bobby Shafto
From: Mark
16. Re: Bad rhymes/bad grammar
From: Mike McKay
17. Aldon Music Staffers 1962
From: Monophonius
18. Re: Bad rhymes/bad grammar
From: James Botticelli
19. Re: Bobby Shafto
From: Rat Pfink
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Message: 1
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 20:03:48 -0000
From: Ian Slater
Subject: Re: Bad Rhymes
A favourite of mine that always brings a smile to my face is from the
Marvelettes' song "Take Me Where You Go":
>From the desert where it is hot,
To the North Pole where it's not...
Part of the naive streak that ran through the superb early Motown output.
In a similar vein were the spelling errors on the front covers of albums:
"Can't Get Use to Losing you" on Martha and the Vandellas first LP (Come
& Get These Memories) and "The Marveletts Sing" on the Marvelettes'
second LP.
Ian Slater
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Message: 2
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 20:20:06 -0000
From: Art
Subject: Re: Orpheus
I too am leaning towards getting the BMG Best of Orpheus. I actually
haven't heard much of their material, but I found a copy of "Can't
Find The Time" back in the early 80's and just couldn't get enough of
it, as well as the flip "Lesley's World". At the time I bought this,
I was unaware that it had gotten so much airplay in the 60's. I
probably wouldn't have heard it-I was living in California at that
time. I know that Orpheus recorded a version of "Walk Away Renee"-I'm
curious to hear their version.
Art
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Message: 3
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 20:29:50 -0000
From: Art
Subject: Re: Best Lines
Jon Adelson wrote:
> One of my favorite lyrics: "Come on baby do a slow float, you're a
> good looking riverboat" (Laura Nyro - "Sweet Blindness")
As I mentioned in an earlier post, I can't stand the fact that
Rolling Stone wouldn't put Laura's "New York Tendaberry" in its top
500 album list. They're every bit as lame as the so-called Rock and
Roll Hall of Fame.
Art
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Message: 4
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 13:59:45 -0700
From: Rex Strother
Subject: Re: Bad Lines
>From "She Believes in Me" - Kenny Rogers:
"I try to get undressed without the light"
And how hard was that, Kenny? Were you afraid the chair was
listening?
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Message: 5
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 16:46:16 EST
From: Ian Chippett
Subject: Re: Claire
> And as for "Claire." I love that song. I really do. And I think
> it perfectly reflects a proper relationship with a very little girl.
> I get teary whenever I hear that song, thinking of my PROPER
> relationships with, for instance, my nieces. I feel a swelling in
> my chest when I hear that song... no where else. I haven't read the
> lyrics lately, but I think the point of that song was to fool you
> into thinking the singer was singing about a "mature" relationship...
> until the end. Then when you heard the song the second or third time,
> you'd realize that all the improprieties where yours, not the singers.
> I'm not pointing fingers at Ian at all, but I think it's sad that we
> live in a time when the Mind Police feel this overwhelming need to
> protect us from interpretations and misunderstandings, especially when
> they diminish a heart's innocence.
I certainly wouldn't include myself among the Mind Police: as I said I
loved this song at the time as well as G O'S's other stuff but he was
never the world's sharpest lyricist and he slipped up here with the "you
get to me in a way I can't describe" bit. I don't really suppose he was
saying what he seemed to be implying but these days they'd be down on
him like a ton of bricks. My plea to otherwise great songwriters like G
O'S is : Get yourself a literate lyricist. The words matter. Even if
you think they don't, some of us do.
Ian Chippett
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Message: 6
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 21:24:55 -0000
From: Mark Frumento
Subject: Re: Orpheus
Art wrote:
> I too am leaning towards getting the BMG Best of Orpheus.
I was lucky enough to get the 2 CD (all 4 LPs) set that came out on
the Italian label Akarma. It seems to have disappeared but it's worth
trying to track down, I think. The Best of comps are nice but they do
leave off some really great, buried LP tracks. One thing I like about
the band is that they seem to have changed their sound on every LP.
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Message: 7
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 16:42:24 EST
From: John Fox
Subject: Re: Bad Lines
> But in this ever-changing world in which we live in...
Again hating to correct, but this could actually be grammatically
correct as:
"But IF this ever changing world in which we're LIVING", which then
goes well with the next line "...makes you give in and cry" (or is
it "makes you give it a try"?)
John Fox
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Message: 8
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 13:35:35 -0800 (PST)
From: Steve Harvey
Subject: Re: Lovin' Spoonful
Jerry also produced a Tim Buckley album with Zally of all people.
Zally dropped out of the rock and roll scene so he could gain
custody of his daughter. That explains why he never came around to
tour. Got to see him on the last night of my honeymoon when my
wife and I went to Chez Piggie. Only wish I'd brought an album
along for him to sign.
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Message: 9
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 22:00:56 -0000
From: Bob
Subject: Re: Snuff Garrett
Clark:
> In reading all the Snuff Garrett info, didn't he have that little
> hand written drawing of himself on records he produced? Am I
> thinking of someone else?
Clark, There was a caricature drawing of Snuff on all of the Snuff
Garrett productions for a time.
Bob
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Message: 10
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 14:02:15 -0800 (PST)
From: Artie Wayne
Subject: Re: Bad Lines / Good Lines
Whenever I used to hear Sam Cooke's "Cupid" and the lines, "I know
with your help her heart I could steal................Help me if you
will"........I would cringe!! Now I find them endearing.
In the 60s, it was common for one songwriter to play their latest
song to another. Carole King and I were waiting at Nevins-Kirschner
publishing [on seperate appointments]....she asked me if I wanted to
hear what she and Gerry Goffin had just written. She sat down and
played what are some of the best lines ever written...........
"Tonight you're mine completly...........You give your love so sweetly
..............tonight the light of love is in your eyes........but,
Will You Love Me Tomorrow?
Carole went in to see Donnie Kirshner before I did...........I heard
him screaming, "It's a SMASH!!! It's a F#*%$!N Smash!!! I assumed he
liked it too.
regards, Artie Wayne
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Message: 11
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 14:45:38 -0800 (PST)
From: Artie Wayne
Subject: Re: Snuff Garrett & "Strings"
Bob.........How ya' doin? I agree that the strings that Snuff
used on Bobby Vee, Johnny Burnette and Gene McDaniels [usually
arranged by Ernie Freeman or Al Capps] were remarkable. I
always considered those soaring, melodic string parts as much
of a hook as anything else in his records.
And speaking of Snuff Garrett.......I'm going to ask him to
verify where "3000 Miles" by Brian Hyland [which he produced
and I wrote] was cut. I played guitar on the date in N.Y.....
though many Spectro-doubters argue that it was cut in L.A.
regards,
Artie Wayne
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Message: 12
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 14:22:01 -0800 (PST)
From: Artie Wayne
Subject: Re: Crooners
Phil.........How ya' doin'? Wouldn't you consider Elvis a
sometime crooner ["Can't Help Falling in Love"]? I don't
believe it was a mike technique that defined a crooner. It
was a romantic song delivered by a sensual [usually baritone]
voice....Como, Crosby and Martin for example.
regards,
Artie Wayne
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Message: 13
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 17:27:51 EST
From: Mike McKay
Subject: Re: Bad Lines & Rhymes
Phil wrote:
> "And no one heard at all,
> Not even the chair."
>
> --Neil D., I Am What I Am, I Said
Bad it may be, but it's Shakespeare next to:
"Songs she sang to me
Songs she brang to me..."
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Message: 14
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 15:38:27 -0800 (PST)
From: Tom Taber
Subject: Re: Bad Lines
Rex Strother wrote:
> From "She Believes in Me" - Kenny Rogers:
> "I try to get undressed without the light"
> And how hard was that, Kenny? Were you afraid the
> chair was listening?
But that line created my favorite Dickie Goodman
moment in "Energy Crisis ('74?)" in answer to the
question as to what some government official was doing
to try to save energy!
Tom Taber
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Message: 15
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 23:50:19 -0000
From: Mark
Subject: Re: Bobby Shafto
Larry Lapka wrote:
> On another subject: I don't even know if their music
> fits in here, but does anyone have any information on
> a group called Bobby Shafto? I think they had a mild
> hit in the late 1960s, but I can't recall off the top
> of my head.
I know that he is British. I have 8 singles by him, all
of them pretty good. I think that only 2 of them came out
here and the rest were from the UK. One song charted at
the bottom of the Top 100. No other info on who Bobby
Shafto is.
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Message: 16
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 17:52:29 EST
From: Mike McKay
Subject: Re: Bad rhymes/bad grammar
My Neil Diamond "brang" example prompted me to revisit a subset
of this lyrical discussion...really bad grammar.
No one will fault a songwriter for simple subject/verb disagreement
(i.e., "He don't love you like I love you") or a double negative
("Don't want you no more") in the service of the vernacular.
But herewith, three of my favorite examples of lyrics that play
TOO fast and loose with the language, to the point that they don't
make sense:
"(Johnny) No he'll never do
(Bobby) No it isn't him, too"
-- "Walking in the Rain," Ronettes
"I been a rambler and a gambler
And I guess I always will"
-- "Heard It in a Love Song," Marshall Tucker Band
("will" what? There's no antecedent for this verb!)
"I've just got to know
Do you love him
Or just makin' time?"
-- "Smoke from a Distant Fire," Sanford-Townsend Band
(Some have suggested this means "Do you love him or do you just love
to make time?" But I'm not buying it. My ear "stumbles" every time I
hear this -- I want to insert "are you" between "or" and "just.")
Other nominations?
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Message: 17
Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 00:16:34 -0000
From: Monophonius
Subject: Aldon Music Staffers 1962
It has been said that Aldon Music had eighteen (18) songwriters
working for them in 1962, all twenty-six years of age or younger.
I can name most of them, but not all. You know, Goffin, King,
Greenfield, Sedaka, Keller, Mann, Weil, Kolber, Miller, et al.
Maybe Artie Wayne could come up with a complete list?
Thanks
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Message: 18
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 19:25:40 -0500
From: James Botticelli
Subject: Re: Bad rhymes/bad grammar
Mike McKay wrote:
> "(Johnny) No he'll never do
> (Bobby) No it isn't him, too"
>
> -- "Walking in the Rain," Ronettes
>
> "I been a rambler and a gambler
> And I guess I always will"
>
> -- "Heard It in a Love Song," Marshall Tucker Band
>
> ("will" what? There's no antecedent for this verb!)
>
>
> "I've just got to know
> Do you love him
> Or just makin' time?"
>
> -- "Smoke from a Distant Fire," Sanford-Townsend Band
Love them...makes next to no sense
"Don't call a doctor
A nurse is worse
'Cause a pill can't kill my pain
When I'm feelin' blue
I know just what to do
To make me feel alright again"
"You're My Remedy" - Marvelettes, written by Smokey Robinson
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Message: 19
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 19:42:39 -0500
From: Rat Pfink
Subject: Re: Bobby Shafto
Larry Lapka wrote:
> I do seem to remember that (he) got some scant airplay here
> in New York on one song, but I just can't recall what the song
> was or any information about (him).
The song was probably "She's My Girl", it made #86 on the Cashbox
charts in July of 1964.
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