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SPECTROPOP - Spectacular! Retro! Pop!
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There are 26 messages in this issue.
Topics in this digest:
1. Rapper DJs' use of vinyl records
From: Rodney Rawlings
2. RE: Best lyrics
From: Hugo M
3. The Chiffons
From: Phil Hall
4. Napoleon XIV
From: Lapka Larry
5. Re: Various
From: Austin Roberts
6. Stewball, The Left Banke, Melodies Rule, etc.
From: Jeff Lemlich
7. Hello everyone
From: Howard
8. Re: Melinda Marx
From: Dan Hughes
9. Re: more BW
From: Paul Bryant
10. Re: Most Inept Hit
From: TD
11. Re: Most Inept Hit
From: John
12. Re: talking to music
From: Phil Milstein
13. Re: Dodgy sound
From: Dave Heasman
14. Re: Tuesday Weld 45
From: Stephane Rebeschini
15. Re: Most Inept Hit
From: Rat Pfink
16. Tuesday Weld 45
From: lobsterman730
17. Re: Ed & Sam Chalpin, His Father the Pop Singer
From: Mike Rashkow
18. Re: Austin Roberts Interview - Arkade
From: Joe Nelson
19. Re: Worst 45 pressings
From: Joe Nelson
20. 4 Seasons
From: Doc
21. Re: Most Inept Hit
From: Paul Balser
22. Re: Artie and Sally
From: John Fox
23. The Swans, and Alder Ray
From: Jimmy Crescitelli
24. Re: Most Inept Hit
From: Mike Rashkow
25. Re: Brian and his imitators
From: Susan
26. Re: Grapefruit
From: Scott Swanson
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Message: 1
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 17:50:27 -0000
From: Rodney Rawlings
Subject: Rapper DJs' use of vinyl records
I'm a bit puzzled by what exactly rapper DJs are doing with vinyl
records and turntables when they accompany a performer. Are they
merely using the needle and grooves to make a scratching sound?
If so, why? Why not a synthetic sound with the equipment they
already have? Doesn't this ruin both the record and the needle?
Do they care what record they use? Do they sometimes let the record
play a bit?
Who started this?
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Message: 2
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 17:30:11 -0000
From: Hugo M
Subject: RE: Best lyrics
I think it was Phil who recently mentioned Richard Hell. Kinda
outside the group's focus, but some of his lyrics have always
impressed me mightily, he does really striking things with meter
sometimes... like the anapests (I think that's right) in "He was
a cartoon, long-forsaken by the public eye" and the first verse
of "Who Says". I can't quote it from memory, and I don't have it
here at hand, but it's about 16 words, with five or six rhymes
stuffed into it without damaging the meaning, craft-y like anything
you could find in Cole Porter... Probably the drugs talking, God
knows, Richard had plenty of time to sit around and head-trip in
those days...
doo-wacka-doo --
Hugo M.
http://free.hostdepartment.com/P/PME
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Message: 3
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 18:00:07 -0000
From: Phil Hall
Subject: The Chiffons
The Chiffons released an album circa 1970 called
"My Secret Love". On it they supposedly covered some
songs by Andrea Carroll that they had backed her on when
she originally recorded them; "It Hurts To Be Sixteen"
and "The Doolang". I don't think it was ever released as a
CD, and I've never been able to locate a copy of it anywhere.
Does anyone remember the album and/or have any of the tracks?
Thanks,
Phil Hall
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Message: 4
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 09:57:55 -0800 (PST)
From: Lapka Larry
Subject: Napoleon XIV
Dear Phil:
Napoleon XIV was someone by the name of Jerry Samuels,
who lived in the same housing development that I did
in South Jamaica, Queens, NY in the 1960s and early
1970s. The place was known as Rochdale Village, a
melting pot of races, creeds and colors if there ever
was one. Since it was nestled right in the middle of
one of the largest African American communities in the
northeast, you heard a lot of diverse sounds by just
walking the grounds of this huge place. It was a good
place for this white Jewish kid to begin a musical
education that continues to this day.
Anyway, back to Samuels, I know a couple of people who
babysat his kids. Also, I knew he turned into one of
the biggest proponents of, shall we say, funny
cigarettes as he got older. He died a few years ago.
Larry Lapka
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Message: 5
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 13:05:52 EST
From: Austin Roberts
Subject: Re: Various
Re: answering Napoleon XIV
AHA!
Re: Medicine Man / Buchanan bros
I don't think so, but if I had a dime for every time I've
been wrong in this life,well you know the rest.
I did a couple of Buchanan Bros. singles and a couple of
other sides under another group name but I can't for the
life of me remember what we called it. Sorry.
Austin
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Message: 6
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 13:35:51 -0500
From: Jeff Lemlich
Subject: Stewball, The Left Banke, Melodies Rule, etc.
Clark Besch:
> One of my fave early 45 purchases as a kid was the
> Peter, Paul & Mary 45 "Stewball". Loved it! Not until a year
> ago at Christmas did I realize that the intro of "Happy Christmas
> (War Is Over)" is a dead on copy of "Stewball"!! John coulda been
> sued before George??!!>
I can definitely hear the similarities, but I'm pretty sure
"Stewball" was in the public domain, with origins that go back
to the early 1800s. I know there have been many variations of the
Stewball theme, some in which he is a blind race horse, others in
which the name is "Sku-ball", others in which the tune is uptempo,
others in which it's a stone blues song. The melody was also nicked
for the "Come Back To Jamaica" advertising campaign!
Phil Milstein:
> According to legend, Brown wrote "Renee" and "Ballerina"
> on the same day (as well as a third masterpiece --
> "Desiree," was it? "She May Call ..."?). If this is even
> close to the truth, it almost defies belief.
The story of the writing of "Walk Away Renee" was told on one
of the Left Banke groups recently. Michael Brown had written
down lines that reminded him of his early childhood -- lines
that formed the basis of the song. Tony Sansone came by --
they went out to deliver food to an old woman -- and then
Sansone helped him refine what would become "Walk Away Renee".
The other two songs came later.
Glenn:
> Case(s) in point - melodies that NEVER should have had words
> written to them:
> "Love Is Blue"
> "Exodus"
> "Love Theme from Romeo and Juliet"
> All three started life, and had immense success, as instrumentals.
> Perfectly gorgeous pieces of music that needed no words.
> All three had offensively schlocky lyrics added to them after-the -
> fact, lyrics that simply destroyed the songs when they were sung.
I may be wrong, but I think "Love Theme From Romeo And Juliet" was
originally a vocal -- "What Is A Youth" -- which was sung in the
film by Glen Weston. If I recall correctly, the instrumental was
based on that song (minus the silly middle eight). I do agree
the later lyrics, "A Time For Us", leave a lot to be desired.
Now playing on Musica: "Shelly Tell Me Why" by River Deep
(Bell 791), featuring vocals by Austin Roberts.
Jeff Lemlich
http://www.limestonerecords.com
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Message: 7
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 19:01:55 -0000
From: Howard
Subject: Hello everyone
Hi,
I've just joined the group and like to post a brief introduction,
my name is Howard, Im 51 years old, and am still an active member
of the progressive northern soul scene, being editor of 'Soul Up
North' fanzine.
I am also a fan of british beat from the 60s, being a 'mod'
from the first time around :-)
I hope I can contribute something useful to the group as well
as making some new friends along the way. I know aready from
reading some of the posts that there are some very clued up
members here and I'll be sure to learn plenty of interesting
stuff too!!
all the best... let's go...
Howard
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Message: 8
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 16:48:06 -0600
From: Dan Hughes
Subject: Re: Melinda Marx
Fred sez,
> Bill Marx recorded a piano/Jazz oriented album for VJ Records in 1963,
> with Harpo featured on the cover introducing Bill as "MY SON, THE
> FOLK SWINGER".
Great title! Obviously a takeoff on the popular Allan Sherman
album MY SON THE FOLK SINGER.
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Message: 9
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 13:36:03 -0800 (PST)
From: Paul Bryant
Subject: Re: more BW
I wrote:
> This I do not understand - why would any record label turn
> down original material from Brian Wilson? Hasn't he long
> since become so revered record executives would love to issue
> anything he wants to do?
Susan wrote:
> Um....how much of Brian's recent [last 20 years, just to pick
> a timeframe], unreleased material have you heard? There are a
> few songs that are pretty good, some that are average at best,
> and a lot that isn't that good. I love Brian, I want him to
> have One More Great whatever inside him, and I want it to come
> out. But the *quality* of that unreleased material that you
> yearn for really isn't that great.
I heard Sweet Insanity, of which I already enthused -
that one's much better than BW's first or Imagination
- and I heard the Andy paley stuff, which is ...
erm... strange. I don't think old Brian has another
Don't Worry Baby in him either, but if I was any kind
of record exec I'd snap up Sweet Insanity and the
Paley stuff as fast as you can say Eugene Landy - the
sheer prestige of having big Bri on my label! Who
cares how much it sells - surely you're gonna cover
your costs!
There you are - that's why I'm not a record exec! I
might mention that I would also have told the Beatles
that a CD composed of all their No 1s was a stupid
idea and no one would buy it as everybody who wants
their stuff has already got it. Would have been
slightly wrong about that too.
pb
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Message: 10
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 17:50:26 -0500
From: TD
Subject: Re: Most Inept Hit
Paul Bryant:
> .. However, my pick for "worst ever guitar solo in a
> hit record" is "Lightnin' Strikes" by Lou Christie - a
> favourite of mine - but just listen again to the solo
> - you talk about One Note Sambas - here's the one note
> guitar solo. So this is also the winner of the Most
> Minimalist Solo of all time too.
Of all time? Listen to the guitar break in the Coaster's
"I'm a Hog for You Baby".
-- TD
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Message: 11
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 23:03:16 -0000
From: John
Subject: Re: Most Inept Hit
> Okay - what's your choice of the most badly performed
> song ever to become a hit? No contest surely, it's got
> to be Louie Louie by the Kingsmen - the drummer loses
> the beat at one point.
You know, it's funny; I would quickly answer "A Thousand Stars"
by Kathy Young and the Innocents for her flat singing. But my
wife loves it, and hates "Angel Baby", which I love. "Angel Baby"
has a pretty bad sax solo, though - on part with "Blue Monday"
by Fats, which may be the worst instrumental break I've ever
heard in an otherwise slick record.
John
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Message: 12
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 17:50:11 +0000
From: Phil Milstein
Subject: Re: talking to music
Paul Bryant wrote:
> Quite true, and we might also mention at this point
> the thin but persistent trickle of talking records
> which have been hits over the years, from Hank
> Williams' Luke the Drifter monologues, via "Ringo" by
> Lorne Greene (a No 1! the only talking No 1?) and I
> think "If" by Telly Savalas (eugh), and all the way
> through to the amazing revival of talking records
> called rap. From Luke the Drifter to Eminem!
But rap is a very different animal than the tradition of talking
records. While a well-made monologue, usually with music behind it,
will be done with an actor's attention to rhythm, that rhythm should
remain subtle, felt yet barely noticeable to the listener. In rap,
however, the rhythms are overt, strong, in fact sometimes half the
point of the entire record. If an analogy can be drawn in which
talking is to walking as singing as to running, rap delivery is
somewhere between a trot and a gallop.
U.S. pop charts in the late '60s and early '70s were veritably
lousy with talking records, but they seem to have gone the way
of the instrumental hit and the novelty hit. A shame.
--Phil M.
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Message: 13
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 23:15:08 -0000
From: Dave Heasman
Subject: Re: Dodgy sound
Billy G. Spradlin:
> I think the worst sounding but one of the greatest early rock
> recordings is Gary U.S. Bonds' "Quarter To Three" - I have it on
> original 45, on a vinyl LP and Rhino CD and they all sound like
> it was recorded with the microphone stuck in a closet or under
> a blanket!
I think it was deliberately recorded that way, trying to get the
"live in the open air" sound. Specifically the sound on
"Ray Charles In Person"
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Message: 14
Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2004 00:41:56 +0100
From: Stephane Rebeschini
Subject: Re: Tuesday Weld 45
lobsterman730 wrote:
> Exactly, how RARE is the TUESDAY WELD 45, "Are You The Boy"
> on Plaza Records? Can anyone share some light on the value
> and the history of this recording?
Fred Clemens:
> I first heard it on Jim Pewter's ROCK SHOPPE, ca.1973-74, a
> syndicated program that took the place of Gus Gossert's show
> on WPIX 102FM in New York. He played it as a mystery song
> where you had to guess the Artist, and apparently the song was
> new then. The flip was called "All Through Spring And Summer",
> which Pewter played a portion of when he revealed the answer.
> I was told a couple of years later that it was on Warner Bros.
> Records, though I've never seen a copy in any form. I would
> say that it is VERY RARE (as opposed to ULTRA RARE).
Hi
You can hear both sides here, on a Tuesday Weld site:
http://www.kokonino.com/weldrecords.html
After listening, you'll surely understand why she recorded only
this single (the vocals on "Are You The Boy" are on a class of
their own, nice arrangements though...)
Happy New Year/ Bonne Et Heureuse Année 2004
Stephane
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Message: 15
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 19:20:13 -0500
From: Rat Pfink
Subject: Re: Most Inept Hit
Paul Bryant wrote:
> Okay - what's your choice of the most badly performed
> song ever to become a hit? No contest surely, it's got
> to be Louie Louie by the Kingsmen - the drummer loses
> the beat at one point.
"Angel Baby" by Rosie & The Originals
RP
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Message: 16
Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2004 00:14:49 -0000
From: lobsterman730
Subject: Tuesday Weld 45
Hi!
I don't know about the soundtrack but the 45 "Are You The Boy"
has got to be the WORST vocal performance ever! Totally off-key!
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Message: 17
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 19:33:52 EST
From: Mike Rashkow
Subject: Re: Ed & Sam Chalpin, His Father the Pop Singer
Michael Greenberg:
> It's a nutty record that I dug because of its incongruity,
> but man, what an ugly (yet very well told!) story of
> exploitation! Yuck! (and thanks!!)
Thanks and good yuck to you.
Di la,
Rashkovksy
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Message: 18
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 19:27:33 -0500
From: Joe Nelson
Subject: Re: Austin Roberts Interview - Arkade
> Cool info from Austin: He wrote and sang lead on "Pretty Mary
> Sunshine" and "Seven Days A Week" from the great, original
> SCOOBY DOO cartoon. Both songs are among my two boys' favorites!
Why do I remember Kid Rhino putting out a Scooby Doo, Where Are You?
CD of the music from the show? Austin's also going to be doing an
interview with Jim Abbott from the 60's and 70's Show at WNHU in New
Haven, CT, and it'd be a groove to get a hold of that music to play
on the show.
Joe Nelson
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Message: 19
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 19:36:03 -0500
From: Joe Nelson
Subject: Re: Worst 45 pressings
Billy G. Spradlin:
> I think the worst sounding but one of the greatest early rock
> recordings is Gary U.S. Bonds'"Quarter To Three" - I have it on
> original 45, on a vinyl LP and Rhino CD and they all sound like
> it was recorded with the microphone stuck in a closet or under
> a blanket!
anon:
>Surely "Quarter to Three" was intended to sound "like it was
>recorded with the microphone stuck in a closet or under a
>blanket". Wasn't that the magic?
I think it was more the use of sound-on-sound overdubbing, which
degrades heavily as each new sound takes the tape back another
generation. If you listen carefully, some sounds are further under
the blanket than others. The crowd noises, added to create a party
atmosphere and dress up an otherwise uninspired performance - were
the last thing recorded and are crystal clear. I have to look into
this further, but I thought I heard a microphone bounce at the
beginning of the track. This suggests to me that something was dubbed
in by putting a microphone in front of a tape recorder/phonograph
speaker rather than directly going into the board. That'd get the
sound for sure.
Joe
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Message: 20
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 19:38:53 -0500
From: Doc
Subject: 4 Seasons
Does anyone know if there is a CD of the 4 Seasons, in mono,
the 45 mixes?
Thanks.
Doc
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Message: 21
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 19:59:05 -0500 (Eastern Standard Time)
From: Paul Balser
Subject: Re: Most Inept Hit
Paul Bryant:
> Okay - what's your choice of the most badly performed
> song ever to become a hit? No contest surely, it's got
> to be Louie Louie by the Kingsmen - the drummer loses
> the beat at one point.
Rat Pfink:
"Angel Baby" by Rosie & The Originals
Wooly Bully gets my vote.
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Message: 22
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 20:03:05 EST
From: John Fox
Subject: Re: Artie and Sally
Dan Hughes,
If we can't get Artie Butler as a Spectropopper, can you at
least ask him why there are two completely different versions
of "Sally Go 'Round The Roses" going 'round--one with an organ
(far superior) and one without? I even think the one with no
organ adds an extra line of singing or two.
Thanks,
John Fox
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Message: 23
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 20:10:58 EST
From: Jimmy Crescitelli
Subject: The Swans, and Alder Ray
Okay... it's time for more girl-group minutiae! I've been
playing Touch the Wall of Sound, Volume 2, in the car, and
"A Little Lovin' Goes A Long, Long Way" never sounded so great.
MAN! And my fave of the week is the Swans' "I Love Him".
Queries: do there exist any photos of the Swans, and Alder Ray?
And one of the Swan's backup singers has a VERY deep voice...
anyone know who these ladies were?
Jimmy Crescitelli
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Message: 24
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 20:17:26 EST
From: Mike Rashkow
Subject: Re: Most Inept Hit
Paul Bryant wrote:
> Okay - what's your choice of the most badly performed
> song ever to become a hit? No contest surely, it's got
> to be Louie Louie by the Kingsmen - the drummer loses
> the beat at one point.
RP:
> "Angel Baby" by Rosie &The Originals
96 Tears???? I'm sure there's been worse but that just
came to mind.
Rashkovsky
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Message: 25
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 20:15:00 EST
From: Susan
Subject: Re: Brian and his imitators
Watson responds to me:
> The best of it, IMHO, is that which he did with Andy Paley.
> But there are many who will tell you that Andy is the best
> BW mimic they've ever heard, and these sessions prove it.
> Ah - someone has mentioned the Elephant In The Room. The
> evidence and the claims do not match up. In all seriousness,
> beware of mines here, Susan; I've been threatened - physically
> - for suggesting this. And it has been going on for a lot
> longer than people like to think. If engineer Steve Desper
> is to be believed, all that wonderful Brianism on the Spring
> album was the work of David Sandler; Desper insisted in an
> interview that Brian's contribution to the album had been
> "minimal". Something to do with brand recognition.
Yes, I've heard this, too, and I believe others have made this
assertion as well. And I'd say Stephen Desper is a pretty credible
source. His memory for detail is encyclopedic, as he demonstrated
at the convention this past summer, and he is not someone I've ever
heard called a liar...
That having been said, my personal opinion is that Andy Paley
was able to take what Brian was offering and "Bri-ify" it. I
think songs like "Desert Drive" tend to be more Andy, and things
like "Soul Searchin'" and "It's Not Easy Bein' Me" are more Brian.
My point was, however, that THIS is the best stuff that Brian
has come up with in a long time. He and Andy clearly get on
well together musically, and these songs are terrific examples
of a recent, positive collaboration in which Brian has engaged.
That's still my point.
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Message: 26
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 17:24:09 -0800
From: Scott Swanson
Subject: Re: Grapefruit
Didn't Mark Wirtz produce Grapefruit at some point??
Just wondering,
Scott
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