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SPECTROPOP - Spectacular! Retro! Pop!
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There are 25 messages in this issue.
Topics in this digest:
1. Re: Medicine Man / Buchanan bros
From: Austin Roberts
2. Re: the first mouseketeers
From: James Botticelli
3. Tuff stuff
From: Jules Normington
4. Re: Gene Hughes
From: Austin Roberts
5. Re: Beatles For Sale
From: Steve Harvey
6. Shangri-Las sessions
From: Jules Normington
7. Re: Mixing down
From: steveo
8. Kestrels; Measles
From: Michael Edwards
9. Skapop
From: Michael Edwards
10. Re: Mixing
From: steveo
11. Re: Ron Dante/Artie Butler
From: Ron Dante
12. Bobby Pedrick
From: Phil Hall
13. Christine Quaite
From: Michael Edwards
14. Re: "In The Rain"
From: Ron Dante
15. Re: If I Fell
From: Peter Kearns
16. Re: Shangri-Las sessions
From: Phil Milstein
17. Re: Herman's Hermits In 70s
From: JJ
18. Re:progressive northern soul - myths
From: Howard
19. Re: Welcome the legendary Artie Butler!
From: Eddy
20. Can I also say Hello to Ron Dante
From: Rosemarie
21. Re: First Gears - The In Crowd
From: Eddy
22. Northern Soul cover-ups
From: Jules Normington
23. Re: one inept ingredient
From: Stephane Rebeschini
24. Re: Skapop
From: Phil Milstein
25. Re: Alvin Robinson / NY drummers
From: Mike Rashkow
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Message: 1
Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2004 18:33:25 EST
From: Austin Roberts
Subject: Re: Medicine Man / Buchanan bros
Bob Rashkow writes:
> I've got "Son of a Lovin' Man" too.
> Great job! Pistilli's lead on "Medicine Man" blew me
> away back in '69. Can't ever stop playing that one!
Hey Bobster,
Gene had a great and unusual quality (still does) to his
voice. Also co-wrote one of my favorite songs "Sunday
Will Never Be The Same".
Best,
Austin
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Message: 2
Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2004 17:40:13 -0500
From: James Botticelli
Subject: Re: the first mouseketeers
Artie Butler wrote:
> Regarding Mousketeer Cubby O'Brien, I believe he lives
> in New York.
Leading to the question 'what happened to
Karen, Mark, Doreen and Bobby?'
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Message: 3
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 13:22:25 +1100
From: Jules Normington
Subject: Tuff stuff
Howard:
> collectable label here in the UK. Bobby Treetop & E. Rodney Jones
> were the same artist, with E.R.J's "R & B Time" sharing the same
> backing track as B.T's "Wait Till I Get To Know You" and wasn't "R
> & B Time (part2)" the instrumental of the top side?
You are oh-so-on-the-mark there about the E. Rodney Jones
'B' side being a part 2...but are you SURE it's not just
a continuation in the fine tradition of some Marva Whitney
/James Brown gems (King didn't mind the ol' Part Two
scenario either, did they.....mind you, Philles were smart
enough to figure you didn't have to waste a perfectly good
song on the 'B' side of a [hopefully] sure-fire seller...
(e.g. "Tedesco & Pitman" etc...)
..but I digress...you may have me there however Howard, re:
the instrumental on the 'B' side thingy (I don't have a copy
to check)...and on the Bobby Treetop 45, to add weight to
the truth (as if the truth ever needs it...well, perhaps to
appease doubters and sceptics)...the 'B' side of TUFF 417,
Bobby's "Wait Till I Get To Know You", is in fact, none other
than "R & B Time" (but maybe you knew that, Howie?).
Classic stuff though, no question.
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Message: 4
Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2004 18:36:11 EST
From: Austin Roberts
Subject: Re: Gene Hughes
Anthony James:
> Can anyone give me some more information about Gene's accident.
> We here in Cincinnati would like to know what happened and when.
> Any info would be great so we can pass on to his fans here.
Anthony,
I'm singing at a show for Gene Hughes in Nashville in Feb.
so I'll find out more and let you know. He's a great guy
and what a voice.
Austin Roberts
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Message: 5
Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2004 18:47:36 -0800 (PST)
From: Steve Harvey
Subject: Re: Beatles For Sale
Paul Bryant wrote:
> So here's a piece of truly trivial Beatles info for
> you. On Live at the BBC, CD1, track 22 (Dear Wack),
> they do a request for someone who lives at 132 Perry
> Road, Sherwood, Nottingham. Well that's just round the
> corner from where I live now. So how about that.
Oh yeah, well Frank Pingatore, who wrote "Clarabella"
(also on the BBC CDs) still cuts hair down in my old
hometown of Wilmington, DE. It's strange that the
Beatles picked up on this Jodimars' (Bill Haley's
former Comets) tune since it never did diddley stateside.
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Message: 6
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 13:50:46 +1100
From: Jules Normington
Subject: Shangri-Las sessions
previously:
> I ask because I read an offhand comment once to the
> effect that the Shangs took it all very emotionally
> and seriously, and consequently the sessions were
> quite ... difficult. Would love to know.
Paul Bryant:
> It wouldn't surprise me, either. Out of all the
> great girl groups, they're the ones who really put a
> lot of soul and suffering into their singing. Gets me
> every time.
Personally they're the ONLY band I went out of the way
to collect (and I was never really the collector type)
...foreign pic sleeves was my speciality...it was hard
to get enough pix of those stunners. (I knocked it on
the head about 15 years ago, mind you.)
Anyway I'd be keen to hear about all their sessions too
...but even more so: has anyone ever managed to get a
copy of the stuff they recorded for Seymour Stein when
he 'supposedly' signed them to Sire in about 1976 ('77
was it?)..it was very definitely reported in some music
mags back at the time that he'd signed them and that
they were in the process of demo-ing new material...I
waited and waited at the time and then read it all went
belly-up.
I'm also keen to know who was it who played as their
backing band when they played live? I'm sure it changed
a bit, but any ideas out there?
Cheers,
Jules
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Message: 7
Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2004 18:50:56 -0800 (PST)
From: steveo
Subject: Re: Mixing down
Billy:
> I have also wondered about monitoring equipment in 60s
> studios, and what volume they mixed down at. I have seen
> old photos where they had big Altec Lansing "Voice of The
> Theatre" speakers and others that looked like the P.A.
> speakers at your church or supermarket.
hi Billy,
Those old Altecs were plenty loud...enuff to cause
hearing damage. Consider this, ..some producers mixed
down on transistor radio sized speakers to gear for
the beach and the kids...it had to sound groovy for
that as well.
Steveo
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Message: 8
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 02:35:01 -0000
From: Michael Edwards
Subject: Kestrels; Measles
Bill Craig asks:
>Is The Kestrels version of "There's A Place" available on CD? Or if
>not do you have it to play to Musica? It's probably my favorite
>Beatle song if I had to pick one. I don't think I've ever heard it
>covered.
>Wasn't there a Brit band called The Measles who covered Paul Revere
>and The Raiders' hits? Sorry if they've already been mentioned.
The Kestrels' version of "There's A Place" came out on a
double CD from UK Sequel, "Smash Hits From The Eagles And
The Kestrels" – 60 tracks in all. Discounted copies are
on amazon.co.uk for around £6.
The Measles covered Paul Revere & The Raiders' "Kicks" on
UK Columbia in 1966.
Mike
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Message: 9
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 03:04:27 -0000
From: Michael Edwards
Subject: Skapop
Julio Nino identifies the following as examples of Skapop:
Shirelles – Long Day Short Night
Annette – Jamaica Ska
Steve Alaimo – I Don't Know
Doris Troy – What'cha Gonna Do About It
Sounds good to me, Julio. If you get a moment why not list out
some more titles. This is lively.
Mike
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Message: 10
Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2004 18:59:32 -0800 (PST)
From: steveo
Subject: Re: Mixing
John Sellards wrote:
> And you can only hear those mistakes only on the stereo
> mixes. On the mono mixes they were corrected. Like Motown,
> mono versions were carefully mixed and the stereo versions
> were quickly done, sometimes by a staff engineer.
John Sellards,
You are right! Mono mixes were carefully mixed by the
producer, and often the engineer was left to mix the
stereo. I have been witness to some of the legendary
Brill personnel, in the studio with them years back
(on the west coast, ironically), and saw them walk out
after doing the mono mix, telling the engineer, you do
the stereo mix!
Steveo
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Message: 11
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 03:10:44 -0000
From: Ron Dante
Subject: Re: Ron Dante/Artie Butler
Artie Wayne:
> S'pop have also reminded me of many stories that will
> be part of a book ... or a ransom note or two!!
Hello Artie.
Thanks for the warm welcome. I too have some stories for
your book. Just kidding. All the best buddy.
Ron Dante
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Message: 12
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 03:13:00 -0000
From: Phil Hall
Subject: Bobby Pedrick
Does anyone know what happened to Bobby Pedrick;
aka Robert John, who had his first minor hit in
the late 50s at age 12 and had several bigger
hits in the late 60s and 70s? His cover of
"Maybe" sounded a lot like Arlene Smith.
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Message: 13
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 03:14:53 -0000
From: Michael Edwards
Subject: Christine Quaite
Howard writes:
>I suspect the 'uknown' female version you have on tape may be
>Christine Quaite, who's version came out on UK Stateside (as did
>Jimmy Radcliffe originally). I'm sure one of the American members
>will tell you what it's US release label was. (without me having to
>get into the loft to ckeck it out : - )
I always thought that Christine was British, having two or
three releases in the early 60s on the UK Oriole label. One
of these was the great "Tell Me Mama"/"In The Middle Of The
Floor", which got a US release on World Artists in 1964.
I don't think Christine's two releases on UK Stateside,
"Long After Tonight Is All Over" (SS 482) and "If You've
Got A Heart" (SS 435) were issued in the US.
Mike
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Message: 14
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 03:16:54 -0000
From: Ron Dante
Subject: Re: "In The Rain"
Ron Dante:
> That was a great session ["In The Rain"]. Don't remember
> the studio name but it was in The American Hotel in NYC.
Rashkovsky:
> Had to be Mirasound. No?
Mirasound it was. Great studio. Terrific live drum sound.
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Message: 15
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 03:26:09 -0000
From: Peter Kearns
Subject: Re: If I Fell
steveo wrote:
> A major seventh in the vocal?
Not to be picky, but it's actually a dominant seventh.
The boys weren't afraid of large intervals in their
two-part harmony. The vocals on 'Baby's In Black' are
another good example of this.
Peter
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Message: 16
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 00:47:08 -0500
From: Phil Milstein
Subject: Re: Shangri-Las sessions
Paul Bryant wrote:
> Can anyone direct me towards any accounts of the
> Shangri-Las' recording sessions? I ask because I read
> an offhand comment once to the effect that the Shangs
> took it all very emotionally and seriously, and
> consequently the sessions were quite ... difficult.
> Would love to know.
> It wouldn't surprise me, either. Out of all the
> great girl groups, they're the ones who really put a
> lot of soul and suffering into their singing. Gets me
> every time.
This intriguing topic is discussed, albeit too briefly,
in Morgan Neville's excellent "Hitmakers: The Teens Who
Stole Pop Music," a 90-minute history of the Brill Building
that played on A&E's Biography (and, I assume, will return
during their frequent rerun periods). Most excitingly, the
segment includes some brief snippets of film of The Shangri
-Las at work in the studio. If only we could get our hands
on the raw footage!
For now, at least, John Grecco's online Shangs history
(http://www.redbirdent.com) remains the most thorough
account of the girls' history, although my own Spectropop
article (http://www.spectropop.com/Shangri-Las), based on
an interview with producer Andy Paley, gives a more in-depth
view of what recording with them was like. However, since the
latter piece only covers their abortion 1977 reunion sessions,
it's not likely to answer your questions precisely.
--Phil M.
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Message: 17
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 07:04:42 -0000
From: JJ
Subject: Re: Herman's Hermits In 70s
csasml2007 wrote:
> One of my great curiosity it's about who was lead vocals
> in some singles that the Herman's Hermits did in the 70s.
LOVE their '75 Private Stock 45, "Ginny Go Softly!
JJ
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Message: 18
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 02:51:19 -0500
From: Howard
Subject: Re:progressive northern soul - myths
James Botticelli:
>Howard...from what I understand, Brits would come to America
>seeking lost soul rekkids in warehouses, basements of rotting
>old soul record shops in third-rate cities, ship's ballast, in
>short, anywhere there were records to be found and even more
>desirable if you got filthy dirty diggin' through damp moldy
>stacks. Then, the story goes, a product known as Vymura was
>applied to the labels of the rekkids to remove them so that
>turntable sniffers couldn't identify and seek out the rekkid
>being played, thereby giving the DJ the exclusivity cachet.
James.. you've got most of the story right in regard to Brits
DJ/dealers scouring anywhere where they might find obscure soul
records that might give the northern soul fan palpitations when
first aired in the UK. (and it's still going on today...) I
haven't heard of anyone removing the labels though as this would
obviously ruin the record and obviously the resale value, where
records are changing hands at hundreds of pounds (more in dollars!)
Dj's have been known to cover the label carefully and give alternate
(fictitional) names & titles to maintain the exclusivity of the
record as long as possible, but of course the truth always comes
out within a few months.
Incidently the reason for covering up the label originally was
to foil the prolific business of what we term in ther UK as
'bootlegging' of the record in vast quanties, copying the record
to sell to the naive northern fans who weren't aware of the
complexeties of originals/re-issues/counterfeits etc. This practice
isn't really viable anymore since the advent of CDs.
cheers..
Howard
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Message: 19
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 08:56:46 +0100
From: Eddy
Subject: Re: Welcome the legendary Artie Butler!
Jonathan:
> ...and let's not forget Artie Butler's "Down Home Girl" which
> he co-wrote with Jerry Leiber and cut on Alvin "Shine" Robinson.
...and got covered by the Rolling Stones !
Eddy
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Message: 20
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 03:33:35 -0800 (PST)
From: Rosemarie
Subject: Can I also say Hello to Ron Dante
I feel like I have known him for the past year - because I
belong to quite a few of the groups that Laura does and not
a day goes by without me reading about him in an e-mail or 5
Ron, I hope you realised just what a Star you have in Laura.
I have been a member here for just over a year now - and enjoy
reading all the messages - not only is this a very informative
group - it is also a friendly group.... and I would like to
personally thank Mike Edwards, Bob Wallis, Austin Roberts and
Mark Wirtz for being so kind to an outsider.
Hugs Guys and Welcome Ron!
Rosemarie
Proud to be an Eddie Rambeau Fan!
http://www.edrambeau.com
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Message: 21
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 09:10:56 +0100
From: Eddy
Subject: Re: First Gears - The In Crowd
previously:
> "The In Crowd" by First Gear is available on the Castle label
> 2CD "Jimmy Page and his heavy friends" (NEECD 486).
> It's also on:
> Doin' The Mod #1 [The Go-Go Train] - CD (Sequel, 2000)
> Jimmy Page - Hip Young Guitar Slinger - CD (Sequel, 2000)
> Jimmy's Back Pages [The Early Years] - CD (Sony, 1992)
"Heavy friends" and "Hip young guitar slinger", that's the same
album. The "Heavy friends" has the more dominant position on the
front cover, but the "slinger" title is on the spine.
Eddy
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Message: 22
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 23:06:26 +1100
From: Jules Normington
Subject: Northern Soul cover-ups
Regarding 'destroying' labels (aka 'cover-ups') on the
Northern Soul scene, there's an interview with Tim Ashibende at
http://members.tripod.com/SoulfulKindaMusic/timashibende.htm
wherein he gives a bit of the lowdown on that seemingly errant
behaviour...it's a good interview actually, if you're keen on
a bit of insider Northern DJ rant...wouldn't you say so Howard?
...Tim sure knows his stuff.
Cheers,
Jules
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Message: 23
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 13:34:16 +0100
From: Stephane Rebeschini
Subject: Re: one inept ingredient
Phil Milstein a écrit :
> About 2/3rds of the way through Little Richard's most manic
> recording, "Keep A-Knockin'", the speed of the whole recording
> suffers a brief "wow", as if the engineer inadvertently brushed
> his hand against one of the tape reels for a second. Not that
> they usually need it, but I like things like that -- they give
> the song an extra little hook.
>From what I've read, the original (and totally manic!) take of
"Keep A-Knockin'" was originally very very short. Specialty
decided to issue a single anyway, but they had to re-use some
of the original take to make a longer song. The "wow" you
mention probably comes from these tape manipulations done
in 1957 (no ProTools then!).
Stephane
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Message: 24
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 00:09:23 -0500
From: Phil Milstein
Subject: Re: Skapop
"Julio Niño" wrote:
> Examples of Skapop that come to mind right now are " Jamaica
> Ska " by Annette (the original is by Byron Lee and the
> Dragonaires), "I Don´t Know" by Steve Alaimo (original by The
> Blues Busters), and "What´cha Gonna Do About It" by Doris Troy.
> Outside of the USA the phenomenon was heard in Italy. Peppino
> de Capri had a hit with "Operazione Sole", later covered in
> Spain by the bizarre combo Los de la Torre.
Interesting topic. I'd never known there was a recognized distinction
between the authentic form of ska and a diluted, pop version, but now
that Julio lays out the basis of this for us it makes perfect sense.
Following is the text of a brief from the July 1964 issue of the
NYC-based amateur songwriters' tipsheet "Songwriter's Review," in which
they weigh in on the Jamaica ska kontroversy. Also, I have a copy of the
pilot episode of Shindig, from July 11, 1964, which included The
Hollywood All-Stars (whoever they were) doing "The Ska." I'd have to dig
it out again to see what kind of boogalooing the dancers are up to. It
seems the industry did what it could to turn ska into the next
music/dance craze -- or at least be ready to service the audience for it
should one erupt (as the British Invasion just had) from under their noses.
"Jamaica Ska" Invading Diskdom
Meet the successor to the twist: the Jamaica Ska.
It has romped into the United States out of the Caribbean, with the
soulful blessing of the Jamaica Minister of Education, who hopes it will
create new tourist trade for the Island.
Sitting on top of the new dance craze is Atlantic Records. The label's
president, Ahmet Ertugen, beat all other diskering by winging to Jamaica
and recording such units as the Blue Busters, Strangers & Patsy, The
Charmers, and Maytals. In all, 40 sides were recorded and now are being released.
Capitol, Mercury and Victor all are getting their releases on to the market.
The Jamaica Ska is more rock than Calypso, despite its origin in Calypso
territory. It is similar to England's "blue beat," containing a heavy
backbeat with a shuffle rhythm.
It is a beat that is expected to appeal to the teenagers and therefore
A & R men expect it to sweep the charts before long.
"Ska" is supposed to be the actual sound of the dance beat.
--Phil M.
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Message: 25
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 08:53:20 EST
From: Mike Rashkow
Subject: Re: Alvin Robinson / NY drummers
Richard Williams:
> Panama Francis, Gary Chester, Buddy Salzmann, Herbie Lovell
> and Bill Lavorgna in NYC. More please from anyone with
> memories to relate!
Panama Francis played left handed and how about Bernard Purdy
and Bobby Gregg.
Di la,
Rashkovsky
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
SPECTROPOP - Spectacular! Retro! Pop!
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