________________________________________________________________________
______________ ______________
______________ ______________
______________ S P E C T R O P O P ______________
______________ ______________
________________________________________________________________________
Music for the Teenager Market
------------------------------------------------------------------------
There are 18 messages in this issue of Spectropop.
Topics in this Digest Number 390:
1. Re: THE JAYNETTS
From: "Justin McDevitt"
2. REGARDING VALLI, GAUDIO & CREWE
From: "Guy Thomas"
3. bigger bits, larger pieces
From: "Paul Payton"
4. Re: Ray Stevens:
From: "Nick Archer"
5. Jody Miller
From: "Robert Conway"
6. Dusty's White Heat
From: Will George
7. Girls on the Beach
From: "Ken Levine"
8. bubblegum debate
From: Alan Zweig
9. Re: Bubblegum
From: Billy G. Spradlin
10. Bubblegum/Jack Spector
From: Joe Foster
11. Re: REGARDING VALLI, GAUDIO & CREWE
From: "Javed Jafri"
12. Re: bubblegum
From: James Botticelli
13. Re: Jeff and Ellie, Country Style!
From: "Nick Archer"
14. Re: Dusty's White Heat
From: Carole Gibson
15. RE: Dusty's White Heat
From: "Keith Beach"
16. You Are What You Eat
From: Marc Miller
17. RE: Jeff & Ellie country style / Sad Old Kind Of / Ray Stevens
From: Michael Rashkow
18. RE: Bob Gaudio
From: Michael Rashkow
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 1
Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2002 00:27:53 -0600
From: "Justin McDevitt"
Subject: Re: THE JAYNETTS
-- Original Message from: Mick Patrick
> I thought I should bring to the attention of everyone the
> STEREO mix of THE JAYNETTS' "SALLY, GO 'ROUND THE ROSES"
> contained on the CD "THE ALL-TIME GREATEST GIRL GROUPS"
> (Varese Sarabande 302 066 110 2, 2000). According to the
> annotation, this newly assembled stereo version contains
> the organ overdub from the 45 (presumably absent from
> other reissues).
Hello Mick and Group,
I recently purchased this CD specifically for the
Jaynetts track. I have two copies of the 45, one in Mono
and the other, sort of Quasi-stereo version of Sally go,
'round the roses both of which in some ways sound better
than the Girl Groups Cd version.
This is a good compilation though I would have liked the
two Motown tracks by The Supremes and Martha and The
Vandellas to be replaced by two alternative non-Motown
tracks.
It's great that the compilation includes the Butterflies
Good Night Baby, which also appeared on the Searchers
1965 LP (can't recall the title) with What Have They Done
To The Rain.
Justin
--------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
Message: 2
Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 11:38:17 -0800
From: "Guy Thomas"
Subject: REGARDING VALLI, GAUDIO & CREWE
Doesn't it seem that Frankie Valli, Bob Gaudio and Bob
Crewe have never really let the world in on their lives
and/or the processes behind their music?
The trio created an incredible amount of great records,
not only with "the hits," but with their b-sides and
album tracks as well. Back in the days when covers of
other artist's hits were the norm, the trio (and founding
group members) seemed almost incapable of just grinding
something out as album filler; they brought something new
to everything they recorded.
Even after the British Invasion took off, they were able
to hold their own well into 1967 definitely having great
success without having to go with the changing times.
And later, when they DID decide to go with the times,
they came back with a vengeance, consistently topping the
late Seventies Pop and Dance charts!
What were the dynamics of the Valli&Gaudio relationship,
as well as their relationship to Bob Crewe? Unless I've
missed them (which is definitely possible) there doesn't
seem to be any books or long form interviews with these
men in which they give the real story behind the music.
How did they feel about not being recognized as was Brian
Wilson & his BBs? Their own brand of creativity and
consistent chart success certainly kept them on a par
with any other act of the era. (Check out Joel Whitman's
Top 40 book for the incredible string of Valli/Seasons
hits.)
I don't get a strong feeling of their willingness to
assimilate into the youth/drug/'let it all hang out'
Sixties culture (look at the style of clothing and most
of all, their hair on their album covers; not to mention
the lyrics from some of their late 60s recordings i.e.;
Beggar's Parade; these pompadoured and tuxedo-wearing
fellows were definitely occupying the 'right of the
political center' side of the musical street.
Did the story behind the Group's music never come to
light because stylistically, they never became a part of
the Sixties youth movement? Possibly so.
Valli and Gaudio were older than many of the other big
artists of the times and seemed be content to stay to
themselves. Definitely not going Hollywood or getting
involved with the arty social circle in New York City or
the West Coast 'scene.' As I understand, Crewe DID go
west and has always maintained varying degrees of
involvement with his painting, art collecting and
antiques. (See janbaum.com, an art gallery website for a
couple of samples of Crewe's art.)
The collaboration/partnership/interaction between the two
chief Seasons and 'outsider' Crewe continues hold great
interest for me.
How did Valli & Gaudio maintained such consistency while
keeping to themselves creatively; and how this all jibed
with their relationship with Crewe.
There's no doubt in my mind, there is much more to the
story than meets the ay-ay-ay-ay.
I'm certain that the real backstory would even give
greater dimension to these remarkable recordings.
I look forward to Spectropop Group member response and
dialog.
PS: As I'm closing this note, it occurs to me that an
in-depth look Bob Crewe's life and career, in music
(totally apart from his work with The 4 Seasons) AND
painting would be equally fascinating.
guy thomas
--------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
Message: 3
Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 10:04:25 -0500
From: "Paul Payton"
Subject: bigger bits, larger pieces
Dan Hughes writes:
> the Nino & April discussion: two flip sides.
I've Been Carrying A Torch For You So Long That I Burned
A Great Big Hole In My Heart is the flip of their biggest
hit, Deep Purple.
That title was it's biggest "selling point" - i.e., talk
about it, but play the hit side! "1:45" wasn't half bad
for a throwaway, and might have made a cute "real"
country song with all the plays on words. It certainly
not was not up to the usual Nino & April standard, though.
Jamie writes:
> Oliver Morgan had a record out in 1964 called "Who Shot
> The Lala." It was coupled with "Hold Your Dog." GNP
> Crescendo #318. (1964)
Thank you - I think! :-)
Robertgippy wrote:
> One of my favories I played is "Down and Out" by George
> Freeman (Valiant #6039) arranged by Perry Botkin Jr.
> Very spectorish, with castanets, thunderous drumroll and
> strings. The flip side called "The Quiver" sound like a
> Philles B Side throwaway, with Hal Blaine style
> drumrolls.
Agree - we used to play it at WBRU in Providence, RI back
in our carrier-current days when we played lots of cool
tunes and had turntable hits on campus. (For those who
don't know, now the station is 20kw, playing modern rock,
and a commercial success, still staffed by college
students. On this list, at least Andrew Simons and I have
it on our resumes.) Did George Freeman do any other
records? (Any more selling for 200 pounds??!?) An album,
perhaps? Any other info on him?
> Doc wrote:
>
> > From my recent Bob Crewe interview:
> > "Where the name the Four Seasons came from? At that time,
> > I was dealing with a little store on the corner of 3rd
> > Avenue and 53rd Street that was called the Four Seasons
> > Antiques. That's where I first picked up on the name.
No matter the source, it had to be better than The Four
Lovers, or Frankie and the Romans, both of which were
earlier handles with slightly different line-ups. (I've
got the Four Lovers covering Jessie Belvin's "Girl of My
Dreams" on an RCA 78, by the way. Ain't bad, but ain't
Belvin - who, IMO, had he not died in that sad car crash
in 1960, would be a major Spectropop discussion topic.
For example, I think his original "Guess Who" cuts the
spangled bellbottoms off Elvis's soulless walk-through -
and there are some fightin' words for ya!)
One more bubblegum comment: the term was invented, if I
remember, by the Buddah gang to promote conscientiously
dumbed-down music that sounded like progressive rock but
would be safe and acceptable for the masses who were
being left out by the more inventive and challenging
music. And _that_ is the naked truth. Having issued these
fighting words, despite that, there were some true gems
to emerge in the genre - and of course, as we all know,
some pompous progressive garbage that came out and
rightfully went right back in.
Interesting sidebar: my wife, a brilliant person in many
ways other than music (she knows what she likes and what
she doesn't, but not necessarily why), called Styx's
"Come Sail Away" "bubblegum" as she dove for the dial to
change the station the other day. Ah, the collision - ir
is that train wreck - of "progressive" and "bubblegum"....
Mike Rashkow writes:
> 101 Strings sessions at Bell Sound. I think the
> guy's name was Dave Miller that did them. Here's
> what they were really. 4 violins, 02 viola and a
> cello overdubbed until Dave thought he had enough.
> He always used to say, "101 strings?...at these
> prices they're lucky they get a hole in the middle!"
I worked at several easy listening stations where 101
Strings were on the playlist. The insider term for the
format was "slush." Thanks for the verification and
vindication - I laughed too! (And a lot of those
Somerset pressings made the original "sandpaper" Cameo
pressings sound like virgin vinyl!)
Finally, Ronnie Allen, I appreciate being the winner of
the Diane Renay double disc! Can't wait till it gets
here! (And no, the fix wasn't in - I actually forgot I'd
entered, which is good, because I never win any contest
I remember entering!)
Country Paul
--------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
Message: 4
Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 05:50:55 -0600
From: "Nick Archer"
Subject: Re: Ray Stevens:
> Michael Rashkow wrote
> I'm a Ray Stevens booster. Think he is a big talent.
One of my favorite Ray Stevens songs is called "Isn't It
Lonely Together?". I don't have all the info but it was
on an early 70's album.
I have met Ray in the course of business in Nashville.
He is a little stand-offish, but hey. He does smoke a
lot of cigars.
Nick Archer
--------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
Message: 5
Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 09:52:28 -0600
From: "Robert Conway"
Subject: Jody Miller
"Don Charles" wrote:
>
> >Anyone interested in hearing Spectropop songs done up
> >country style should check out Jody Miller's Anthology
> >CD, which includes C&W versions of "Be My Baby," "He's
> >So Fine," "To Know Him Is To Love Him" and "Will You
> >Love Me Tomorrow".
>
>Sounds like a winner! Ms. Miller was one of the first
>celebrities to add her signature to my "Let's Send Jeff
>Barry and Ellie Greenwich to Cleveland" petition. Very
>nice person. Incidentally, she also cut an excellent
>country version of "Lay A Little Lovin' On Me,"
>originally cut by Robin McNamara for Jeff's Steed label.
I enjoyed Jody Miller's occasional Cap. pop singles in
the mid-sixties. Being a long-hair and in a band
probably moved my musical scale in favor of the Miller
version vs. Bonnie and the Treasures. I say that because
although the Spector version was certainly the more hip
of the two, Miller sang the lyrics in a (for me) really
believable heart-felt fashion....(jumping ahead years
later)...The Jody Miller "hits collection" was near the
top of my CD fantasy list during the infancy of the CD
revolution when artist's catalogs on CD were hit-or-miss
to say the least. Needless to say I was thrilled to
finally discover just a few years ago that there would be
a collection of Jody Miller's sixties catalog...but also
upon purchase I was sad to see that one of her best
singles, "Magic Town," was omitted. And isn't that the
way is often goes with long-awaited best-of type
collections?...with record execs often doing the dealing
it seems like consumers usually end up a card or two
short of a full deck. A pet peeve of mine and perhaps
the subject of discussion at a later date. -Bob Conway
--------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
Message: 6
Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 09:30:31 EST
From: Will George
Subject: Dusty's White Heat
I've been looking for a copy of Dusty's White Heat LP
for ages. Would anyone out there be so kind as to burn
me a copy? Perhaps I can trade some Jackie DeShannon?
Thanks,
Bill
--------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
Message: 7
Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 18:00:02 -0800
From: "Ken Levine"
Subject: Girls on the Beach
privilege
Check your local listing for AMC and if GIRLS ON THE
BEACH is on again you MUST make it a viewing priority.
This 1964 beach movie starring Noreen Corchran and Lana
Wood featured outstanding performances by the Beach Boys
and Lesley Gore (singing in a surf club wearing a dress).
In fairness, Lesley does wear shorts in one music number
but that's after an earlier song at the sorority house
(which is on the beach -- wonder what University that is??)
where Lesley wears a suit. The direction makes William
Asher look like Scorcese. Ed Wood would have some
notes. And when four sorority girls put on wigs and try
to pass themselves off as the Beatles and get away with
it, well you just have to rise to your feet and applaud.
I guess Carl Wilson wasn't available when they shot the
Beach Boy scenes (perhaps he had read the script) so
instead someone else just took his place. But they all
wore the same shirts so who's going to notice? If
Noreen Corchran can pass for a Beatle then
guy-with-nice-hair can certainly fill the bill as a
Beach Boy. So many highlights. One of my favorites
was a reflective scene on the beach at night. Brian and
the lads singing "Lonely Sea". Great mood piece except
it was filmed day-for-night and swimmers and surfers
were clearly visible in the water. Most surfers go out
at 11 pm. (And of course, you can't beat an artist
finishing his song by trailing off.) But they covered
that pesky day/night issue brilliantly by also doing the
reverse. Everyone is rocking out in the surf club (you
would imagine at night). Then a character goes outside
to use the phone and the sun's so bright the audience
has to squint. It's an absolute classic. Or, as one
of the sorority girls says about the Beach Boys, "it's
the nutsiest!".
--------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
Message: 8
Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 15:27:18 -0500
From: Alan Zweig
Subject: bubblegum debate
> From: "Don Charles"
>
>It certainly IS debatable. Just as debatable is the
>question of who the market for that kind of music really
>was. In my opinion, most of the releases from the
>Kasenetz-Katz stable were marketed at adults, given the
>preponderance of sexual doubles entendres in songs like
>"Yummy, Yummy, Yummy," "Chewy Chewy," "Mercy" and "Come On
>Down, Mary Ann."
I don't know if sexual undertones says anything about the
marketing. I didn't know that "rock n roll" was a
euphemism for having sex when I was 12 years old but I
still liked it. The rock n roll I mean.
I flipped through the Bubblegum book and it was filled
with musical acts I wouldn't have considered "bubblegum"
at the time. And I can sort of understand how a lot of
acts have gotten thrown into the bubblegum wrapper. I'm
the one who's always arguing that pop/rock was just a big
messy scramble back then.
Your basic pop/rock unit was pushed into all kinds of
sub-genres. This week they're the Association. Next week
they're the Strawberry Alarm Clock. The week after that,
they're the Iron Butterfly. Even the 1910 Fruitgum Company
eventually made a conceptual rock record, "Hard Ride".
Having said that, I think of bubblegum as a much more
specific and short-lived genre. It was more specific than
just cutesy pop. Or to put it another way, not all cutesy
novelty rock was bubblegum. I'm pretty sure I saw the
Cowsills in the Bubblegum book. They were kind of cute
but to me, they weren't bubblegum.
It had to do with a certain voice quality, which I can't
describe but which I'm sure you all are hearing in your
head right now. It was that voice combined with the
cutesy titles and a sort of cleaned-up garage rock sound
that defined bubblegum to me.
But it seems like, in retrospect, anything that was kind
of cutesy or cartoony is being called bubblegum. Which is
okay by me. I'm no purist.
Now, will someone tell me where the sexual innuendo is in
"Chewy Chewy"?
AZ
--------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
Message: 9
Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 23:40:30 -0000
From: Billy G. Spradlin
Subject: Re: Bubblegum
> Why else do you think Britney Spears is trying so
> desperately to convince people that she's "not that
> innocent?" Despite her obvious appeal to teenagers,
> she doesn't want to acknowledge that demographic too
> openly. I expect to Britney to announce a
> forthcoming Playboy centerfold any day now . . .
What do you expect from a 19 year old girl who's singing
idol is Madonna?
She and her management company had the sense to throw a
little T&A into the mix by hiring a former porn director
to direct most of her videos and having a lot of "sexual
overtones" in her lyrics. The pre-teens didnt catch it
but the older teens and we adults certantly did! But I
think that's why she is so popular - there are a lot of
people who will never admit they like Britney and the
Backstreet Boys but sing-a-long when thier music gets
played on MTV or Radio. Bubblegum artists have a short
shelf life - the female teenage audiance quickly
outgrows them and kids grow up MUCH faster and know so
much more about sex than when I was a kid. Its just a
sign of the times, I guess.
Speaking of Sexual Overtones in Bubblegum music - my
fave is "Jelly Jungle" by the Lemon Pipers:
"Take a ride on my pogo stick (ding!)"
"Jump up and down - do a trick!"
And "In the Jelly Jungle of Orange Marmalade - (echo)
Laid Laid Laid Laid Laid Laid....!!"
Billy
--------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
Message: 10
Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 19:48:23 +0000
From: Joe Foster
Subject: Bubblegum/Jack Spector
With the recent posts about Bubblegum and "Good Guy"
Jack Spector, I thought this bit of synchronicity from
the notes to the Buddah Box would be of
interest...written of course by the late, great Bob
Hyde.....Joe
"There must have been a sense of silliness at the
company at this time, for besides all the bubblegum
releases, the company scored as well with a novelty
called "Moonflight" by a character named Vik Venus.
Venus was actually WMCA (New York City) disc jockey
Jack Spector, who narrated the cut-in record that
featured excerpts from most of Buddah's bubblegum hits.
The concept had worked in 1956 with Buchanan & Goodman
("The Flying Saucer") and in 1960 ("The Touchables") by
Goodman alone; in 1969, the novelty treatment by
Spector and the gang garnered Buddah a Top 40 hit."
--------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
Message: 11
Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 00:44:18 -0500
From: "Javed Jafri"
Subject: Re: REGARDING VALLI, GAUDIO & CREWE
> I don't get a strong feeling of their willingness to
> assimilate into the youth/drug/'let it all hang out'
> Sixties culture (look at the style of clothing and most
> of all, their hair on their album covers; not to mention
> the lyrics from some of their late 60s recordings i.e.;
> Beggar's Parade; these pompadoured and tuxedo-wearing
> fellows were definitely occupying the 'right of the
> political center' side of the musical street.
The Four Seasons did record one "serious" 60's type album
called "Genuine Imitation Life Gazette" and they even
tried to look a bit hipper on the cover of that one. My
personal favorite late 60's recording by the group is
"Tell It To The Rain" and oh yes the last time I heard
"Let's Hang On" I somehow mistook the first few notes for
"A Question of Temperature" by the Balloon Farm" not sure
how I managed to do that as I have listened the song a
gazillion times. Finally, I also think that Opus 17
stood up to all competitors from 1966 very well.
Javed
--------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
Message: 12
Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 02:03:01 EST
From: James Botticelli
Subject: Re: bubblegum
> I don't know if sexual undertones says anything.
right
> Your basic pop/rock unit was pushed into all kinds of
> sub-genres. This week they're the Association. Next week
> they're the Strawberry Alarm Clock. The week after that,
> they're the Iron Butterfly.
Look at the haircuts....
> Having said that, I think of bubblegum as a much more
> specific and short-lived genre. It was more specific than
> just cutesy pop.
>
> It had to do with a certain voice quality, which I can't
> describe but which I'm sure you all are hearing in your
> head right now. It was that voice combined with the
> cutesy titles and a sort of cleaned-up garage rock sound
> that defined bubblegum to me.
good job nailing the essential irrelevance!
> But it seems like, in retrospect, anything that was kind
> of cutesy or cartoony is being called bubblegum. Which is
> okay by me. I'm no purist.
who is at this age??~
> Now, will someone tell me where the sexual innuendo is in
> "Chewy Chewy"?
one must chew to be renewed
--------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
Message: 13
Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 05:58:41 -0600
From: "Nick Archer"
Subject: Re: Jeff and Ellie, Country Style!
About three years ago the Beach Boys came to Nashville
and recorded with a group of country singers. The album
was called "Stars and Stripes Forever". I would say only
two of the artists on the CD "got it". Junior Brown doing
"409", and Christian artist Kathy Triccoli on "I Can Hear
Music".
I think a lot of the current country acts (and current hot
producers) would have a hard time of it. And label
politics would make it difficult. Occasionally a pop
wonder strikes from the blue, like Alison Krauss and "Baby,
Now That I've Found You", but I look for this stuff, and
it's rare.
Nick Archer
Nashville
--------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
Message: 14
Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 07:43:29 +0000
From: Carole Gibson
Subject: Re: Dusty's White Heat
If it's the actual vinyl you're looking for, it does come
up often on Ebay but if it's a CD, then it's due to get
it's first release in the UK very soon. The date given
was 4th March to co-incide with the anniversary of Dusty's
death but of course, these things often get delayed. In
fact all of her back catalogue, not yet released in it's
original form on CD is supposed to be out at the same time, 05 CD's in all.
regards
Carole
--------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
Message: 15
Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 07:38:50 -0000
From: "Keith Beach"
Subject: RE: Dusty's White Heat
It's about to be issued on CD...check Amazon.com
keith beach
>I've been looking for a copy of Dusty's White Heat LP
>for ages. Would anyone out there be so kind as to burn
>me a copy? Perhaps I can trade some Jackie DeShannon?
--------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
Message: 16
Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 12:16:20 -0500
From: Marc Miller
Subject: You Are What You Eat
Country Paul, re:
> Kevin Kern: thanks for filling in the "You Are What You
> Eat" soundtrack blank - and for the compliment. Does
> anyone know if it's available, either CD or LP?
It was available on a Columbia CD (issued in 1989), but
has been out of print for several years now.
Marc
--------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
Message: 17
Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 21:00:32 EST
From: Michael Rashkow
Subject: RE: Jeff & Ellie country style / Sad Old Kind Of / Ray Stevens
Norman writes:
> Anyway, as much as I rate Macaulay as great, why
> would Ellie Greenwich sing one of his songs.
>
> Maybe I hold her in too much esteem but I would
> imagine she could teach him how to write a song or
> two.
It was done at the "request" of Larry Uttal, President of
Bell Records.
---------------
In a message dated 2/17/2002, don charles writes:
> Well, after having spoken directly to Jeff
> Barry and to Ellie Greenwich's manager Bob Weiner, I can
> say I'm not the only one who has engaged in such
> speculation. It turns out that both Mr. B and Miss Ellie
> would be thrilled to pieces if a country artist or group
> of country artists recorded a tribute album of their hits.
>
> And why the hell not?
Why the hell not indeed. I'd be thrilled if Mary In The
Morning was recorded in Swahili, Thai, and Tagalog---you
know what I mean? It's a business, baby cakes.
Money, money money, money!
---------------
Thanks, Lindsay for reminding me about Misty--yeah, it's
a whole new song his way. Really unique feel--it ain't
exactly country--it swings.
It's been great to see that I'm just one of many people
who like Ray Stevens' work.
Rashkovsky
--------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
Message: 18
Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 21:23:56 EST
From: Michael Rashkow
Subject: RE: Bob Gaudio
Guy Thomas writes:..Bob Gaudio.
He deserves a bit of focus. At one time he produced
Frank Sinatra, but most wonderfu of all, he was
responsible for producing the sound track for Little
Shop Of Horrors. Now that's the sound of Rock &
Roll--a little tongue-in-cheek, but nailed in the heart.
The boy knew what he was doing. The record mix sucks.
I copied all the song tracks off the video.
I guess everyone knows the voice of Audrey was Levi
Stubbs--how good was that?
Suddenly Seymour may be a parody, but if you can just
forget the name Seymour it's a grand piece of business.
God, next I'll be talking about Tommy Dorsey, can't
someone keep me on subject.
Rashkovsky
--------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
End
